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Olivia Evans

Why was I denied unemployment benefits by Washington ESD?

Got my determination letter from Washington ESD yesterday and I was denied unemployment benefits. The letter mentions something about 'voluntary quit without good cause' but I don't understand this at all. I left my job at a retail store because my manager was cutting my hours from 35 to 15 per week and I couldn't afford to live on that. Isn't that a good reason? The letter says I can appeal but I'm confused about what exactly I did wrong. Has anyone else dealt with this kind of denial?

Unfortunately, Washington ESD considers most voluntary quits as disqualifying unless you can prove 'good cause.' Reduced hours can sometimes qualify as good cause, but you need to show you tried to resolve it with your employer first. Did you document your conversations with your manager about the hour cuts?

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I talked to her about it but didn't really document anything formal. Should I have put something in writing?

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Yes, Washington ESD wants to see you made reasonable efforts to keep your job. Written documentation helps prove that during appeals.

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This happened to my sister last year. She quit because of hour cuts too and got denied initially. You definitely need to appeal this - the reduction in hours might qualify as 'constructive dismissal' if it was significant enough.

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What's constructive dismissal? The letter didn't mention that term at all.

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It's when working conditions become so bad that any reasonable person would quit. Going from 35 to 15 hours is pretty drastic.

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You should definitely appeal this denial. I had luck getting through to Washington ESD using a service called Claimyr (claimyr.com) when I needed to discuss my appeal. They have a video demo at https://youtu.be/7DieNd3C7zQ that shows how it works. Really helped me avoid the usual phone runaround when I needed to talk to an actual person about my case.

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How does that work exactly? I've been trying to call Washington ESD for days with no luck.

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They basically handle the calling for you and get you connected to an actual ESD agent. Saved me hours of busy signals and hold music.

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Never heard of this but anything is better than spending my whole day redialing the same number.

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The appeal process for unemployment denials is pretty straightforward but you need to act fast. You only have 30 days from the date on your determination letter to file an appeal with Washington ESD. Make sure you gather any evidence about the hour reduction and why it made continuing work impossible.

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Do I need a lawyer for the appeal or can I handle it myself?

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You can represent yourself in most cases. The hearing is usually by phone and fairly informal. Just be prepared to explain your situation clearly.

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ugh the Washington ESD system is so frustrating!! They deny everyone first it seems like, then you have to fight for what you deserve. I got denied twice before finally getting approved.

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That's discouraging. How long did the whole process take for you?

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like 3 months total between appeals and waiting. but I did get back pay for the whole time eventually

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For your appeal, focus on these key points: 1) Document the exact hour reduction (35 to 15 hours), 2) Show this made the job financially unsustainable, 3) Provide any evidence you tried to discuss this with management, 4) Calculate how the reduced income fell below minimum survival needs. Washington ESD looks for concrete evidence that quitting was your only reasonable option.

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This is really helpful. Should I include my rent receipts and bills to show the financial impact?

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Absolutely. Showing that 15 hours per week couldn't cover basic living expenses strengthens your case significantly.

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I work in HR and see this situation a lot. When employers cut hours that drastically, they're often trying to force people to quit so they don't have to pay unemployment. It's a common tactic unfortunately.

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That makes sense actually. My manager did seem like she wanted me gone but didn't want to fire me directly.

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Exactly. That's why you need to frame this as constructive dismissal rather than voluntary quit. The employer made continuing work impossible.

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This is why documentation is so important when employers start playing games with schedules.

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Update: I tried calling Washington ESD again today to ask about the appeal process but still can't get through. The automated system just hangs up after saying high call volume. This is so frustrating when I'm on a deadline to appeal.

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This is exactly why I mentioned Claimyr earlier. When you're dealing with time-sensitive stuff like appeals, you can't afford to waste days trying to reach them.

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Try calling right at 8am when they open. Sometimes you can get through in the first few minutes.

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I'll try the early morning approach tomorrow, but might also look into that Claimyr thing as backup.

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Whatever you do, don't miss that 30-day appeal deadline! I missed mine by like 2 days and had to go through a whole separate process to get it reopened. Washington ESD is super strict about those timelines.

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Good point. I've got about 3 weeks left so I need to get moving on this.

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Yeah don't wait until the last minute either. Give yourself time in case there are problems with the filing.

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You can file your appeal online through your Washington ESD account or by mailing the appeal form. Online is faster and you get confirmation it was received. Make sure to write a clear statement explaining why the hour reduction constituted good cause for leaving.

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I didn't know you could appeal online. That's much better than mailing something and hoping it gets there on time.

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Yes, log into your eServices account and look for the appeal option. It should be pretty straightforward from there.

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same thing happened to me but my hours got cut because of 'business needs' - still got denied initially. The appeal hearing judge was much more reasonable than whoever reviews the initial claims. Don't give up!

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That gives me hope. Did you have a lawyer for your hearing?

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Nope, represented myself. Just told the truth about why I had to quit and provided my pay stubs showing the hour cuts.

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Make sure you keep filing your weekly claims even during the appeal process! A lot of people don't know this and lose out on benefits if they win their appeal. You won't get paid during the appeal but you'll get back pay if you win.

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Wait, I should keep filing even though I was denied? That seems weird.

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Yes! If you don't file weekly claims during the appeal, you can't get back pay for those weeks even if you ultimately win.

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This is correct. Always continue filing weekly claims during any appeal period to preserve your right to back pay.

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The Washington ESD hearing officers seem to understand that people can't survive on drastically reduced hours. I've seen several cases where voluntary quits due to hour cuts got overturned on appeal. Your situation sounds pretty strong actually.

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That's encouraging. I was starting to think I had no chance at all.

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A 20-hour per week reduction is significant. Just make sure you can articulate why continuing at 15 hours wasn't financially viable.

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BTW when you do get through to Washington ESD (whenever that happens), make sure to ask them about the specific reason code they used for your denial. Sometimes there are multiple issues and the letter doesn't explain everything clearly.

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Good tip. The letter was pretty vague about the specifics.

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This is another reason why Claimyr can be helpful - you can actually get through to ask these detailed questions instead of guessing.

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don't let them intimidate you with the formal appeal process - it's really just explaining your side of the story to someone who will actually listen, unlike the initial review process

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Thanks, I was worried it would be super complicated and formal.

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nah its pretty casual, they just want to understand what really happened

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One more thing to consider - if your employer fights the appeal, they'll have to prove that 15 hours per week was still a 'suitable' job for you. Most hearing officers recognize that's not realistic for someone who was previously working full-time hours.

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Will my employer definitely show up to the hearing?

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Not always. Many employers don't bother with appeal hearings, especially for obvious cases like dramatic hour reductions.

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I had a similar denial overturned last year. The key was showing that I made efforts to find additional work to supplement the reduced hours before quitting. Even though I couldn't find anything, it showed I tried to make it work.

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I did apply to a few other part-time jobs to try to make up the difference. Should I mention that in my appeal?

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Absolutely! That shows you tried to mitigate the situation before quitting. Very helpful for your case.

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Just want to add that Washington ESD's initial denial rate is pretty high, but the appeal success rate is much better. Don't get discouraged by the first rejection - it's almost like they expect you to appeal if you have a legitimate case.

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That's really good to know. Makes me feel less like I did something completely wrong.

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yeah this is totally true, they deny tons of valid claims initially

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Quick practical tip: when you write your appeal statement, use the phrase 'constructive discharge' or 'constructive dismissal' - it's the legal term for when working conditions become so bad you have no choice but to quit. Hearing officers recognize this terminology.

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Thanks for the specific wording. I wasn't sure how to phrase it legally.

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Exactly. Using the right terminology can make a big difference in how your case is perceived.

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Final update from me - I actually got through to Washington ESD this morning using that Claimyr service someone mentioned earlier. The agent confirmed that hour reductions can qualify as good cause and walked me through what I need for my appeal. Definitely filing it this week!

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Glad that worked out for you! Having actual guidance from an ESD agent makes the appeal process much less scary.

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Excellent news. Make sure to reference that conversation in your appeal if the agent gave you specific guidance.

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Wait, that was me posting the update - I meant to update everyone. Thanks for all the help, this thread has been incredibly useful!

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