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This is a great question and I'm glad to see so many helpful responses already! I went through this exact scenario with my rental property business last year and learned a lot through trial and error. One thing I'd add to the excellent advice already given - make sure you're paying your kids a truly reasonable wage for the work they're doing. The IRS scrutinizes family employment situations closely, so paying your 15-year-old $50/hour for basic cleaning would definitely raise red flags. I researched what other teens in my area were earning for similar work and kept my kids' pay within that range. Also, consider having them open their own business checking accounts to deposit their paychecks. It creates a cleaner paper trail and helps teach them financial responsibility. My kids love watching their Roth IRA balances grow - it's been a great way to get them interested in investing and long-term financial planning. The documentation is key though. I keep detailed logs of not just hours worked, but specific tasks completed, materials used, and even photos of the work being done. Better to over-document than under-document when it comes to family employment!
This is really helpful advice! I'm just starting to think about this for my own situation. Quick question - when you mention having them open business checking accounts, do you mean separate accounts just for their work income? Or are you talking about them literally setting up their own small businesses? I want to make sure I understand the best way to structure this from a documentation standpoint. Also, how do you handle the tax withholdings? Do you actually withhold income tax from their paychecks or just let them handle it at year-end since they're probably not earning enough to owe much anyway?
Great question about the checking accounts! I meant separate personal checking accounts just for their work income - not business accounts. This helps keep their employment earnings separate from any allowance or gift money, which makes tax filing cleaner and creates a clear audit trail. For tax withholdings, I actually do withhold a small amount for federal income tax even though they likely won't owe anything. This way they get the experience of receiving a tax refund when they file their returns, which is a good learning opportunity. Plus it ensures we're following proper payroll procedures. Since they're typically in the 0% or 10% bracket, the withholdings are minimal anyway. The key is treating them like any other employee from a paperwork standpoint - W-4 forms, regular pay periods, proper withholdings, and W-2s at year end. It might seem like overkill for family members, but it's exactly what the IRS expects to see if they ever audit the situation.
This is such a smart financial strategy! I wish my parents had thought to do this when I was younger. One thing I'd add that hasn't been mentioned yet - make sure you understand the kiddie tax rules if your children have other investment income. While earned income from working in your business is generally taxed at their own rates (likely 0% or very low), if they have significant unearned income from other sources (like dividends, interest, or capital gains over $2,650 in 2025), it could be taxed at your marginal rate instead of theirs. This usually isn't an issue for most families, but it's worth being aware of as their investment accounts grow over time. The Roth IRA strategy is fantastic though - starting retirement savings at 15-17 gives them such a huge head start with compound growth. Even if they never contribute another dollar after age 18, those early contributions will be worth a fortune by retirement. You're setting them up for financial success in a big way!
This is exactly the kind of long-term thinking that makes such a difference! I'm actually just getting started with real estate investing myself and this whole thread has been incredibly eye-opening. The kiddie tax point you raised is something I hadn't considered at all - definitely good to know as these accounts grow over time. I'm curious though - for someone just starting out like me, what would you recommend as the minimum amount to pay kids to make the Roth IRA contributions worthwhile? Obviously it needs to be reasonable for the work they're doing, but I'm wondering if there's a sweet spot where the tax benefits and retirement savings really start to make sense versus just giving them the money as an allowance or gift. Also, has anyone had experience with this strategy when the kids are already earning income from other part-time jobs? I'm wondering if there are any complications when they have multiple income sources.
I went through this exact same struggle last year with my J-1 visa from Canada! The language barrier definitely makes these forms even more confusing than they already are. One thing that really helped me was finding the actual treaty text between the US and Spain on the IRS website. Search for "United States Spain Income Tax Treaty" and look for the PDF. Article 20 is usually the one that covers students and trainees - it should give you the exact language you can reference in your Form 8833. Also, don't feel bad about calling the IRS multiple times if you need to. I called three different times and got three different answers, but the third agent was really knowledgeable about international treaties and walked me through everything step by step. For what it's worth, I found that keeping my answers in the boxes simple and straightforward worked better than trying to be too detailed. The IRS just wants to understand your situation clearly. Β‘Buena suerte! You've got this - it's definitely intimidating but once you get through it the first time, next year will be much easier.
Thanks for mentioning Article 20! I actually found the US-Spain treaty PDF and you're absolutely right - Article 20 is exactly what I needed. It's so much clearer when you can see the actual treaty language instead of trying to guess what applies to your situation. I'm definitely going to try calling the IRS again. Maybe I'll get lucky and reach someone who actually knows about international tax treaties this time. Your point about keeping the answers simple is really helpful too - I was overthinking it and trying to write paragraphs when they probably just want the basic facts. Β‘MuchΓsimas gracias! It's so reassuring to hear from someone who went through the same thing and made it through successfully.
I completely understand your frustration with Form 8833 - I went through the same struggle when I was on my J-1 visa from the Netherlands a couple years ago. The language barrier definitely makes these already complex forms even more challenging. Here's what worked for me: Start by finding your specific treaty article on the IRS website. For Spain, you'll want to look up the US-Spain Income Tax Treaty and find Article 20, which typically covers students and trainees. This will give you the exact language to reference in your form. A few practical tips that helped me: - Keep your explanations in each box concise and factual rather than overly detailed - For Box 4, only include income that's specifically exempt under the treaty (like stipends or scholarships related to your J-1 program) - Don't be afraid to call the IRS international tax line multiple times - I found some agents much more knowledgeable than others One thing I wish I'd known earlier: if you're receiving any payments from Spanish institutions or organizations as part of your J-1 program, those are typically the amounts you'd claim exemption for, not any side income from US sources. The first year is definitely the hardest, but once you get through it and understand the process, subsequent years become much more manageable. Β‘Γnimo!
Real talk - once you see code 150, look for cycle code next to it. That can tell you what day of the week updates happen for your account. Major π to watching your transcript!
Code 150 is definitely one of the most important ones to understand! It's basically the IRS's way of saying "we've processed your return and here's what we calculated." The date next to it shows when they finished processing, and the amount shows your total tax liability. From there you can track if you have credits, payments, or refunds coming by looking at the other transaction codes that follow. It's like the foundation that everything else builds on!
This is super helpful! I'm new to all this tax stuff too and was wondering - after code 150, how long does it usually take to see other codes show up? Like if I'm expecting a refund, should I be checking daily or is there a pattern to when things update?
Just wanted to mention that recreating a depreciation schedule isn't necessarily super expensive. I'm surprised your new tax pro is making a big deal about it. When I switched accountants, mine recreated 8 years of depreciation schedules for about $150. They said it was pretty straightforward since residential rental property typically uses straight-line depreciation over 27.5 years. You might want to ask for a specific quote before assuming it'll be expensive. Also worth considering is that you'll need this documentation whenever you sell the property to properly calculate your adjusted basis and depreciation recapture, so it's an investment in proper record keeping.
$150 seems really cheap. My accountant quoted me $375 to recreate a depreciation schedule for just one property that I'd owned for 5 years. I wonder if there's a big difference in complexity between properties or just in what different preparers charge?
I'm a CPA and this situation is unfortunately more common than it should be. Your previous preparer was absolutely required to file Form 4562 if they were claiming depreciation on your rental property - there's no way around it in legitimate tax software. What likely happened is one of two scenarios: 1) They were filing the form but just not giving you copies (which is still poor practice), or 2) They were manually entering depreciation amounts without properly completing the required schedule (which is concerning from a compliance standpoint). Before paying to recreate everything, I'd strongly recommend requesting your complete tax return transcripts from the IRS first. You can do this online through the IRS website or by calling them. The transcripts will show exactly what forms were filed with your returns. If Form 4562 was actually filed, you can request complete copies of your returns including all schedules. If the forms weren't filed properly, then yes, recreating the depreciation schedule is necessary and worth the investment. Just make sure your new preparer gives you copies of everything going forward - you should always have a complete copy of your tax return including all schedules and supporting documentation.
Amara Okafor
Has anyone considered the state tax implications of MFS vs MFJ? Some states have different rules than federal. My wife and I found that while federal was slightly better filing jointly, our state taxes were significantly better filing separately because of how our state handles itemized deductions.
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CosmicCommander
β’This is such an important point! We're in Illinois and while federal was clearly better filing jointly, our state calculation was completely different. We ended up filing jointly for federal but separately for state (which our state allows). Saved us about $900 total.
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Amara Okafor
β’You're absolutely right about checking state rules. Each state has its own approach to married filing separately vs jointly. Some states require you to use the same filing status as your federal return, while others allow you to choose a different status for state taxes. For example, in states like New York and California, the tax brackets for MFS aren't exactly half of MFJ brackets, which can create opportunities for tax savings in certain income scenarios. Your state might also have unique deductions or credits that aren't affected by filing status the same way federal benefits are.
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Giovanni Colombo
Something nobody's mentioned yet - you should consider future tax planning too. If you think your income might change significantly next year (like one person taking time off work or getting a big promotion), that could affect which filing status makes sense this year due to things like AMT planning and tax loss harvesting across years.
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Fatima Al-Qasimi
β’Could you explain more about how future income changes might affect this year's decision? My husband is likely taking a lower-paying job next year so our income will drop about 40%. Should we be considering that for this year's tax filing?
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