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Thanks everyone for the great information! To summarize what I've learned: there's NO hourly limit, just the earnings cap of $59,520 for months before FRA in 2025. I need to track when money is EARNED not paid, and be proactive about reporting if I might exceed the limit. Investment income doesn't count toward the limit, and any benefit reductions now will increase my benefit amount later. Really appreciate all the help!
Sounds like you've got it! One last tip - if you're close to your FRA and have flexibility with your work schedule, sometimes it makes sense to shift some income to after your FRA month when there's no limit at all. Good luck with everything!
Just wanted to add one more important detail that might help - if you do end up exceeding the earnings limit, Social Security typically stops your benefits entirely until they've withheld the required amount, rather than reducing each monthly payment proportionally. So if you owe $3,000 in withheld benefits and your monthly benefit is $1,500, they'll stop TWO full months of payments rather than reducing 6 months by $500 each. This can create cash flow issues if you're not prepared for it. Planning ahead with SSA is definitely the way to go if you think you might go over the limit!
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Wait I'm confused now...is WEP the same as the Government Pension Offset (GPO)? Cuz my uncle lost his WHOLE spousal benefit from my aunt's record because of his pension...
No, they're different provisions: - WEP (Windfall Elimination Provision) affects your OWN Social Security benefits if you have a pension from non-covered employment - GPO (Government Pension Offset) reduces or eliminates spousal or survivor benefits if you have a government pension from non-covered work GPO is generally more severe - it reduces spousal/survivor benefits by 2/3 of your government pension amount. The original question here is about WEP, which applies to the person's own retirement benefits. But both provisions can apply if you're eligible for multiple benefit types.
I just went through a similar situation with my state pension and WEP! One thing that really helped me was creating a spreadsheet with all my Social Security earnings by year and comparing them to the substantial earnings thresholds for each year. You can find the historical substantial earnings amounts on the SSA website. With your 42 quarters and roughly 7-8 years of substantial earnings, you'll likely face some WEP reduction, but the new reform should make it more proportional to your actual contributions. The old formula was much harsher for people with mixed public/private careers like ours. I'd strongly recommend getting that in-person appointment at SSA - bring printouts of your complete earnings record and be prepared to wait, but it's worth it to get the exact calculation. They can run both the old and new WEP formulas to show you the difference. In my case, the new formula saved me about $180/month compared to what I would have lost under the old rules. Also, make sure to ask about how the transition period works if you're planning to retire soon - there are different implementation timelines depending on when you claim benefits.
This is really great advice about creating the spreadsheet! I'm definitely going to do that before my SSA appointment. It's encouraging to hear that the new formula actually saved you $180/month - that gives me hope that it might help my situation too even if I don't have many years of substantial earnings. Did you find the SSA representatives were knowledgeable about the new WEP rules, or did you have to educate them about the changes? I'm worried about getting conflicting information since it sounds like the implementation is still being rolled out.
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Just wanted to add one more tip from my experience - when you do get that SSA appointment, bring documentation of ALL your earnings history if you have it. I brought my old W-2s and tax returns from my private sector years, and it helped the agent verify my substantial earnings years more quickly. Also, don't be discouraged if the first agent you speak with seems unsure about WEP calculations. I had to speak with a supervisor to get accurate numbers. The calculation is complex and not all front-line staff are equally familiar with it. One last thing - if you're married, make sure to ask about how WEP might affect any spousal benefits your spouse might be eligible for. The rules are different than for your own retirement benefit. Good luck with your appointment! It sounds like you're being very thorough in your planning, which will serve you well.
This is excellent advice about bringing documentation! I hadn't thought about bringing old W-2s but that makes perfect sense for verifying the substantial earnings years. I'm definitely going to gather all my paperwork before the appointment. And good point about asking for a supervisor if needed - I'd rather get accurate information than accept unclear answers. Thanks for the tip about spousal benefits too - my husband will probably have questions about that aspect.
I'm in a similar situation but about 5 years behind you - currently 61 and working for my city government with 13 years of service, plus 17 years in private sector before that. Reading through all these responses has been incredibly helpful, especially learning about the substantial earnings threshold and how continuing to work in SS-covered employment after government retirement could reduce WEP penalties. One question I haven't seen addressed: does it matter WHEN during the year you start collecting SS benefits if you're continuing to work? I'm wondering if there are any tax advantages to starting benefits at the beginning vs middle vs end of a calendar year, especially when you're still earning a government salary. Also, has anyone dealt with state taxes on SS benefits while still working? My state taxes SS benefits and I'm trying to figure out the overall tax impact of collecting both my salary and SS in the same year. Thanks to everyone for sharing their experiences - this thread is a goldmine of practical information that you just can't get from the official pamphlets!
Great questions about timing and taxes! From what I understand, there's no specific advantage to starting SS benefits at any particular time during the year if you're past FRA - you'll get the full monthly benefit regardless. However, the tax implications can be significant when you're earning both salary and SS in the same year. For federal taxes, up to 85% of your SS benefits may be taxable depending on your combined income (which includes half your SS benefits plus other income). Since you'll have government salary income, you'll likely hit the higher taxation threshold. You might want to consider adjusting your tax withholding or making quarterly estimated payments to avoid a big tax bill. As for state taxes on SS benefits, that varies widely by state. Some states don't tax SS at all, others tax it fully, and some have income thresholds. You might want to consult with a tax professional who can run scenarios based on your specific state and income levels. One thing to consider: if your state does tax SS benefits heavily, the timing of when you retire from your government job versus when you start collecting SS could make a difference in your total tax burden for those transition years.
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Thank you all for the helpful responses. I really appreciate the different perspectives. I'm going to try calling SSA to discuss our specific numbers, and I'll use that Claimyr service since regular calls haven't worked. Based on your comments, I'm leaning toward not suspending since we do need the current income, but I'll run all the calculations first, especially considering the survivor benefit aspect. This forum has been incredibly helpful!
You're making a smart decision to get the actual numbers before deciding! One thing that might help - when you talk to SSA, ask them to calculate what your benefit would be at age 70 with the delayed credits, and then ask what your wife's survivor benefit would be based on that higher amount. Sometimes seeing those concrete dollar figures makes the decision clearer. Also, don't feel bad about starting benefits when you did - you made the right call given your wife's health situation at the time. Life rarely follows the "optimal" financial plan!
I went through a similar decision process about 6 months ago. One thing that really helped me was creating a simple spreadsheet to compare the scenarios over different time horizons. I calculated the total cumulative benefits for both my wife and me under three scenarios: (1) keeping current benefits, (2) suspending for 1 year, and (3) suspending for the full 3 years until age 70. What surprised me was how much the decision depends on your ages and health expectations. If there's a significant age gap between you two, or if you have family history of longevity, the delayed credits become much more attractive because of that survivor benefit increase everyone mentioned. Also, don't overlook the tax implications - higher Social Security benefits later might push you into a higher tax bracket or cause more of your benefits to be taxable. Worth running those numbers too before making the final call.
This is such a helpful approach! Creating a spreadsheet to compare different scenarios sounds like exactly what I need to do. I hadn't thought about the tax implications either - that's a really good point. My wife is 3 years younger than me, so the survivor benefit calculation becomes even more important. Would you be willing to share what columns/categories you included in your spreadsheet? I want to make sure I'm not missing any key factors in my analysis.
Astrid Bergström
wait does she get any of his benefit if he passes away? or does gpo still apply to widow benefits to?
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Ravi Patel
•GPO also applies to survivor benefits, but the calculation might be more favorable. As a widow, she could be eligible for up to 100% of his benefit (instead of 50%), which means after the GPO reduction, there might still be a partial survivor benefit payable. Using the numbers shared: If she became eligible for his full $3,760, minus the GPO reduction of $1,467, she could potentially receive $2,293 as a survivor benefit (replacing her current $480). This would be an important consideration for future planning.
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Ava Johnson
Based on the detailed discussion here, it sounds like your mom's situation is unfortunately common but there are definitely some avenues worth exploring! The math that Omar laid out is spot-on - with her $2,200 state pension creating a $1,467 GPO reduction, she wouldn't get additional spousal benefits since her own $480 is higher than the remaining $413. However, I'd really encourage you to dig into those exceptions that Ravi and others mentioned. The 60-month rule could be a game-changer if she paid SS taxes during her final years of state employment. Many teachers and state employees don't realize their districts sometimes switched to SS-covered positions near retirement. Also, that service Astrid mentioned (claimyr) might be worth the investment if you keep hitting dead ends with SSA phone calls. Sometimes paying a small fee to skip the phone queue nightmare is worth your sanity and time. Good luck, and don't give up - these rules are complex but there are people out there who can help navigate them!
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