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Paolo Conti

How to Adjust Withholding to Owe $8k at Tax Time for Credit Card Rewards?

So for our 2023 taxes, we ended up owing $17.3k to the IRS when we filed our return. I used the IRS withholding calculator and adjusted our W-4 forms with extra withholding, thinking we'd get closer to breaking even. But instead, we got a $4.2k refund for 2024! I thought the whole point of that calculator was to help you get to approximately zero? I'm actually trying to do something specific now - I want to deliberately owe about $8k when we file next year to help with some credit card sign-up bonuses and rewards (paying taxes with credit cards). Could someone check my math or give advice on how to calculate this correctly? Here's our info (filing Married Joint): Taxable income: 2023: $211k 2024: $269k 2025 estimate: ~$289k Total tax: 2023: $33.6k 2024: $46.2k Income tax withheld: 2023: $13.8k 2024: $46.8k Tax returns: 2023: -$17.3k (owed) 2024: +$4.2k (refund) Based on the differences in returns, taxable income, and withholding, I calculate that we should withhold about $20.8k in 2025 to end up owing $8k when we file. Does that seem right to anyone who's done this before?

Amina Sow

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Your calculation approach makes sense, but let's double-check the math to make sure you get the outcome you want. The key is understanding your effective tax rate and applying it to your projected income. Based on your estimated 2025 taxable income of $289k, your total tax liability will likely be around $49-50k (assuming tax brackets stay relatively similar to 2024 with inflation adjustments). If you want to owe $8k at tax time, you'll need to have approximately $42k withheld throughout the year. One thing to be careful about: if you deliberately underwithhold too much, you might get hit with an underpayment penalty. To avoid this, you generally need to pay at least 90% of your current year tax or 100% of your previous year tax (110% if your AGI was over $150k) through withholding or estimated payments. Since you're doing this for credit card rewards, make sure the rewards value exceeds the processing fees for paying taxes with credit cards (usually 1.87-1.98%).

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GalaxyGazer

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What about estimated tax payments? Couldn't OP just reduce withholding even more and then make a large estimated payment in January with a credit card to avoid penalties? Also curious if anyone has experience with which tax payment processor has the lowest fees for cc payments?

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Amina Sow

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You're absolutely right about estimated tax payments! That's actually a smart approach - OP could reduce withholding significantly, then make larger estimated payments with credit cards to hit minimum spend requirements when needed. The IRS considers withholding to have been paid evenly throughout the year, even if it was mostly withheld in later months. However, estimated payments are credited when you make them. So this strategy gives more flexibility for timing credit card payments. For processors, the current options are PayUSAtax (1.96%), ACI Payments/OfficialPayments (1.99%), and pay1040.com (1.87%). Pay1040 typically has the lowest fee, but it's worth checking current rates when you're ready to pay since they do sometimes change.

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Oliver Wagner

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I went through a similar situation last year trying to optimize my tax payments for credit card rewards. Have you checked out https://taxr.ai? I started using it after having issues with miscalculating my withholding multiple times. Their tax simulator helped me figure out exactly how much to withhold to get the tax bill I wanted at filing time. They have a feature specifically for planning withholding strategies throughout the year, and it lets you factor in credit card payment fees so you can see if your rewards will actually exceed the processing costs. It saved me from making a big mistake with my withholding calculations.

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This sounds interesting. Does it work well for self-employed people too? My income is pretty variable throughout the year and I'm always struggling to figure out if I'm paying enough in estimated taxes.

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I'm a bit skeptical... is this just a fancy calculator or does it actually do something the free IRS calculator doesn't? I'm pretty good with spreadsheets, but I hate how the withholding calculator on the IRS site is so vague with its recommendations.

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Oliver Wagner

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For self-employed people, it's actually really helpful because it lets you project variable income and plan quarterly payments accordingly. You can adjust your expected earnings throughout the year and it recalculates your estimated payment needs automatically. As for what makes it different from the IRS calculator - it's much more detailed and lets you run multiple scenarios. The IRS calculator just gives you a single recommendation based on the info you input. With taxr.ai, you can play with different income levels, deduction strategies, and see exactly how changes affect your final numbers. I found it especially useful for optimizing retirement contributions alongside tax withholding. Definitely more powerful than a basic spreadsheet unless you're really good at tax formulas.

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I was initially skeptical about taxr.ai mentioned above, but I ended up trying it for my withholding calculations. Best decision I made for my tax planning! I was in a similar situation - married filing jointly with about $245k income and trying to optimize our withholding. The simulator helped me identify that I was overlooking how my wife's bonus would impact our overall tax rate. I was able to adjust our withholding to land exactly where we wanted - owing about $6k at tax time but avoiding any underpayment penalties. The visualization tools made it super clear how each paycheck's withholding affected our year-end position. I'm actually planning to use their quarterly checkup feature to make sure we stay on track throughout 2025. Definitely worth checking out if you're trying to be precise with your tax planning.

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Emma Thompson

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If you're serious about optimizing your taxes for credit card rewards, you need to also consider how you'll interact with the IRS if anything goes wrong with your calculations. I spent WEEKS trying to reach someone at the IRS last year when my calculated withholding was way off due to a job change. I eventually found https://claimyr.com which got me connected to an actual IRS agent in under 30 minutes. You can see how it works here: https://youtu.be/_kiP6q8DX5c They basically navigate the IRS phone system for you and call you back once they've reached an agent. I used it when I needed specific guidance on how job changes affect withholding calculations. The agent walked me through exactly how to adjust my W-4 to accommodate multiple income sources.

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Malik Davis

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Wait so this service just calls the IRS for you? Couldn't you just do that yourself? How much does it cost? Sounds like a waste of money for something you could do on your own.

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I've heard about these services and always wondered if they actually work. The IRS phone lines are notoriously bad - when I called last April, I waited over 2 hours and then got disconnected! Does this service really get you through faster than waiting yourself?

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Emma Thompson

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It doesn't just call for you - it navigates their entire phone tree and waits on hold in your place, which can literally be hours. You only get called once an actual human agent is on the line. The last time I called the IRS directly, I waited 2.5 hours before giving up. The value isn't just in making the call - it's in not wasting your day listening to hold music. You can go about your normal activities, and they call you when an agent is ready to talk. For complex tax situations like the one the original poster has with specific withholding calculations, getting accurate information directly from the IRS can prevent costly mistakes.

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Malik Davis

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I was totally skeptical about that Claimyr service when I first read about it here. I thought "this is ridiculous, I'm not paying for someone to call the IRS for me." Then tax season hit and I needed clarification on withholding requirements after switching to a new job with significantly higher pay. I tried calling the IRS myself first - spent 2 hours on hold before my call dropped. Tried again the next day - another 1.5 hours before I had to hang up for a meeting. Finally gave in and tried Claimyr. Not exaggerating, I was talking to an actual IRS representative within 25 minutes. They sorted out my withholding confusion in another 10 minutes. The agent explained exactly how much I needed to withhold to avoid penalties while still optimizing for my financial goals. Saved me from potentially owing way more than I planned for. For anyone trying to precisely calculate withholding like the OP, having direct access to an IRS rep for specific questions can make a huge difference.

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StarStrider

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One thing I didn't see mentioned yet - if you're trying to owe exactly $8k for credit card purposes, remember that the payment processors have maximum limits per payment type. I think pay1040.com limits you to two payments per tax period per type (extension, estimated payment, tax return payment). So if you're planning to put the full $8k on credit cards, you might need to split it between multiple payment types or processors. I usually do one payment through pay1040 and one through PayUSAtax to maximize what I can put on cards.

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Paolo Conti

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That's a really important point I hadn't thought about! Do you know if those processor limits are per card or per taxpayer? Like could my wife and I each make payments on our separate cards for the same joint return?

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StarStrider

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The limits are per taxpayer, not per card. So for a joint return, both you and your wife could each make payments up to the maximum. This effectively doubles your capacity. What I did last year was have both my wife and I make payments through both pay1040.com and PayUSAtax, which let us put about $16k total on cards. Just make sure you're keeping track of all payments to avoid overpaying accidentally. And definitely check the current limits when you're ready to pay - they do change these policies occasionally.

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Ravi Gupta

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I tried doing exactly what you're planning a couple years ago and ended up getting hit with an underpayment penalty that wiped out a chunk of my credit card rewards. Make sure you meet one of the safe harbor rules: 1. Owe less than $1,000 in tax after subtracting withholding (obviously not your case) 2. Pay 90% of the tax for the current year through withholding 3. Pay 100% of the tax shown on your previous year's return (110% if your AGI was over $150k) For your income level, you'd need to hit that 110% of previous year mark to be safe.

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Yeah I got burned by this too. The 110% rule is KEY for higher earners. One trick I found is to make sure that withholding is sufficient rather than estimated payments - the IRS treats withholding as even throughout the year even if you increase it in December, but estimated payments are credited when made.

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Ravi Gupta

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That's absolutely right about the timing advantage of withholding vs. estimated payments! If OP realizes in December they're going to be short, they can adjust their W-4 for a big withholding from their last few paychecks, and the IRS will treat it as if they paid evenly throughout the year. Another thing to consider is that credit card fees (around 2%) might exceed rewards unless you're hitting signup bonuses or have a card with really good rewards categories for tax payments. Always good to do that math before proceeding.

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