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Something no one has mentioned yet - have you considered a Partial Pay Installment Agreement (PPIA)? With your level of debt and equity situation, this might be your best option. A PPIA lets you make monthly payments based on what you can afford after necessary living expenses. The key difference from a regular installment agreement is that you might not pay the full amount before the collection statute expires (usually 10 years from assessment). I went through this process myself, and while it's not easy, it can significantly reduce what you ultimately pay. You'll need to provide detailed financial statements (Form 433-A or 433-F) and the IRS will review your finances every 2 years to see if your payment should increase.
I hadn't heard of a PPIA before - that sounds like it might be a good option for my situation. Does the 10-year collection statute still apply even with the large amount I owe? And what happens during those financial reviews every 2 years?
Yes, the 10-year collection statute of limitations applies regardless of the amount owed, though be careful because certain actions can extend that period. The clock starts from the date the tax was assessed, not from when you enter into the agreement. During the biennial financial reviews, the IRS will request updated financial information to determine if your financial situation has improved. If you're making substantially more money or have acquired significant assets, they may increase your monthly payment amount. Conversely, if your situation has worsened, you might qualify for a lower payment. This is why documentation of your expenses and financial situation is crucial throughout the process.
Has anybody mentioned bankruptcy? I know it sounds extreme, but with that level of tax debt, it might be worth consulting with a bankruptcy attorney who specializes in tax issues. While not all tax debts can be discharged in bankruptcy, some can if they meet certain criteria (generally, income taxes over 3 years old where returns were filed at least 2 years ago). Even if the taxes can't be discharged, a Chapter 13 bankruptcy might help structure a payment plan that takes into account your other debts and financial obligations.
This is actually a really important point. Tax debt that's more than 3 years old CAN be dischargeable in bankruptcy under certain conditions. I consulted with a bankruptcy attorney for my own tax issues and while I ended up not filing, the consultation alone gave me leverage in negotiating with the IRS because I understood my options better.
One thing nobody has mentioned yet - the IRS has a program called "First Time Abatement" (FTA) that might help you. If you haven't had any penalties in the past 3 tax years, you can qualify even without proving you filed the extension. When you write your letter, specifically request consideration under the First Time Abatement policy. Include language like "I request abatement of penalties under the First Time Abatement administrative waiver, as I have not had any penalties assessed in the prior 3 years." I'm a bookkeeper and have helped several clients get penalties removed this way even when they couldn't prove they'd filed extensions on time.
Does FTA work for all types of penalties? Like would it work for this specific CP 162 notice for partnership returns?
Yes, the First Time Abatement policy applies to the failure-to-file and failure-to-pay penalties for Form 1065 (partnerships), which is what CP 162 notices typically address. The FTA is available for most common penalties including these partnership return penalties. The key qualification is having a clean compliance history for the three years prior - meaning you filed all required returns and paid (or arranged to pay) all tax due. If your LLC is newer than three years, they'll look at your personal tax compliance history as the partner/member.
Lesson learned - ALWAYS use certified mail with return receipt for anything important you send to the IRS! I've been doing this for years and it's saved me multiple times. For requesting abatement, include a detailed timeline of exactly what you did and when. Be very specific about dates. The more detailed your explanation, the better your chances.
Better yet, e-file everything possible! I haven't mailed anything to the IRS in years. Extensions can be e-filed too, even for partnerships.
For future reference, there's an option on the W4 form specifically for this situation. In Step 2, you can check box c for "Multiple jobs or spouse works" which helps adjust your withholding. For even more accuracy, you can use the multiple jobs worksheet. I'd also recommend checking your withholding at least once midyear using the IRS Withholding Calculator: https://www.irs.gov/individuals/tax-withholding-estimator That way you can catch these issues before tax time and adjust as needed!
Thank you! I've already updated both my W4 forms for this year, but I'll definitely use that calculator to double-check everything. Is it normal to owe this much though? I'm still shocked at how big the difference was.
Yes, unfortunately the amount you owe is pretty typical for this situation. When you add a second job with similar income, you're essentially doubling your income but your withholding isn't doubling the tax paid because each employer is calculating withholding based on their portion only. For example, if you make $80K at one job, you might be withheld at an effective rate of about 12-15%. But when your total income is $160K, portions of that income are taxed at 22% or 24% brackets. That difference between what was withheld (at lower rates) and what you actually owe (at higher rates) is where that $5K+ bill comes from.
I'm surprised nobody mentioned this, but you should also check if you qualify for any tax credits or deductions that might offset some of what you owe. Did you have any education expenses during the year? Student loan interest? Making retirement contributions? Health insurance through the marketplace?
This is good advice. Also, make sure you're taking the standard deduction at a minimum ($12,950 for single filers for 2022). And if you made any charitable contributions or had work-related expenses that weren't reimbursed, those might help too.
Thanks for bringing this up! I do have some student loan interest from when payments were still required, and I contributed to my 401k at both jobs. I'll definitely look into those deductions. Do you think it could significantly reduce what I owe?
Just wanted to add something important about cost basis that nobody mentioned yet. If you reinvested dividends over time (like in a mutual fund), those reinvestments increase your cost basis! I missed this for years and was essentially paying double tax on my dividend reinvestments. Make sure all your reinvested dividends are included in that cost basis number or you could be overpaying.
Wait, really? I've been investing for 5 years and never knew this. So if my dividends automatically buy more shares, I need to add those amounts to my original investment when calculating gains/losses?
Exactly! When dividends are automatically reinvested to buy more shares, you've already paid income tax on those dividends in the year you received them. Those reinvested amounts become part of your cost basis. If you don't add them to your cost basis, you'll end up paying tax twice - once when you received the dividend, and again when you sell the shares (because your gain would appear larger than it actually was). This is especially significant for long-term holdings where years of reinvested dividends can substantially increase your true cost basis.
Has anyone found a good tax software that handles stock sales well? I tried one of the free ones last year and it kept getting confused when I entered multiple stock sales.
Emily Thompson
Don't forget about FBAR requirements! If your foreign (UK) bank accounts totaled over $10k at any point during the year, you need to file FinCEN Form 114. The penalties for not filing these can be way worse than not filing your taxes. I got hit with this when I finally sorted my situation out. Had no idea I needed to report my UK pension, savings, and current accounts to the US Treasury Department (separate from IRS). Luckily I qualified for penalty waiver through the streamlined procedures.
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Isabella Russo
ā¢I hadn't even thought about reporting bank accounts! What's the threshold again - is it $10k across all accounts combined or each account needs to be over $10k?
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Emily Thompson
ā¢It's $10k across all foreign accounts combined at any point during the year. So if all your UK accounts added up to over $10k even for one day, you need to file. This includes accounts you have signature authority over, even if not yours (like a joint account with a partner or business account). The form is fairly straightforward but needs to be filed electronically through the FinCEN BSA filing system. You'll need to report maximum account values, account numbers, bank addresses, etc. Keep in mind this is separate from your tax return and goes to the Treasury Department, not the IRS.
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Sophie Hernandez
One option you might consider is renouncing your US citizenship if you never plan to live there. It's drastic but some expats do it to escape the filing requirements. There's a fee (around $2,350) and you need to be tax compliant for 5 years first. Just something to consider if the annual filing becomes too much of a burden. Though with the tax treaties and exclusions, most people in the UK don't actually owe anything - it's just the paperwork hassle.
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Daniela Rossi
ā¢That fee used to be like $450 not that long ago! The US gov dramatically increased it when too many people started renouncing. Plus if your net worth is over $2M or your average tax liability over 5 years exceeds a certain threshold, you could be hit with an exit tax. Not a simple solution unfortunately.
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