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Don't forget that even if you qualify for First Time Abatement, it only applies to certain penalties! It works for failure-to-file, failure-to-pay, and failure-to-deposit penalties. It won't help with accuracy-related penalties, fraud penalties, or estimated tax penalties. Also, it's a one-time deal for each type of penalty. So if you get the FTA for a failure-to-file penalty this year, you can't get another one for failure-to-file in the future. But you might still qualify for an FTA on a different type of penalty later.
Well crap, I already used my FTA for a missed estimated tax payment in 2022. Does that mean I'm totally out of luck for getting my current late filing penalty removed?
Actually, you might still have options! First Time Abatement is available separately for different penalty types. So if you used FTA for an estimated tax penalty in 2022, you should still be eligible for FTA on failure-to-file or failure-to-pay penalties since those are different categories. The IRS tracks FTA usage by penalty type, not as a single overall benefit. So you could potentially get FTA relief for your current late filing penalty even though you used it for estimated tax penalties before. I'd definitely call or submit a request - worst case they say no, but there's a good chance you're still eligible for this different penalty type.
Douglas, you're definitely in a good position for First Time Abatement with 8 years of clean filing history! I successfully got my penalties waived last year using this exact process. Here's what worked for me: I called the IRS directly using the number on my penalty notice and specifically asked for "First Time Abatement relief." The rep was able to pull up my compliance history right there and approved the request on the spot. My $620 in penalties were removed immediately from my account. The key is being very clear about what you're requesting - don't just say you want penalty relief, specifically mention "First Time Abatement" or "FTA." The IRS reps are familiar with this program and can process it quickly if you qualify. Since you mentioned the payment deadline is next month, I'd recommend calling rather than mailing Form 843, as the written process can take 8-12 weeks. With your clean history, you should have no problem getting approved. Just be prepared for potentially long hold times when calling - early morning (8 AM EST) tends to be the best time to get through. Good luck! With your track record, this should be pretty straightforward.
This is really encouraging to hear! Quick question - when you called, did they ask for any specific documentation or proof of your compliance history? I'm worried they might want me to provide copies of old returns or something I don't have readily available. Also, did you have to pay anything upfront while waiting for the decision, or were you able to hold off on the penalty portion?
No documentation needed at all! The IRS rep could see my entire filing and payment history right in their system when I called. They just verified a few basic details like my SSN and address, then confirmed I had clean compliance for the required period. The whole call took maybe 15 minutes. As for payment, I was able to hold off on paying the penalty portion while the request was being processed. I did pay the underlying tax amount to stop interest from accruing on that, but you don't have to pay penalties while an abatement request is pending. Just make sure to pay any actual tax owed to avoid additional interest charges. The system removal was instant once approved - I could see the penalties were gone when I checked my account online later that same day. Really straightforward process overall!
I tried doing an OIC myself first and ABSOLUTELY REGRET it!! Wasted 5 months and got rejected for "incomplete financial information" even though I sent everything they asked for. Then I hired a tax attorney who charged $4,200 flat fee for both federal and state. They refiled everything and my offer got accepted 6 months later. Settled $93k of tax debt for $11k. So worth every penny of their fee!!! My advice: don't try to save money by doing it yourself or hiring the cheapest person. This is one area where experience really matters. I probably lost more in penalties and interest during those wasted 5 months than I paid my attorney.
What made your attorney's submission different from what you submitted yourself? I'm trying to figure out if there are specific tricks or approaches that professionals use that individuals don't know about.
The main differences were in the financial documentation and presentation. When I did it myself, I just filled out the forms with basic numbers. My attorney created detailed spreadsheets showing my complete financial picture, included supporting documents for every expense claim, and wrote a compelling hardship narrative that explained WHY I couldn't pay the full amount. They also knew exactly which expenses the IRS allows vs. doesn't allow. For example, I had included some expenses that the IRS doesn't recognize, which weakened my case. My attorney restructured everything to show maximum allowable expenses while staying within IRS guidelines. The biggest difference was the negotiation aspect. When the IRS came back with questions, my attorney knew how to respond professionally and provide exactly what they wanted. When I tried to handle their questions myself, I apparently gave responses that raised red flags and led to the rejection.
The $4,200 fee you mentioned is definitely within the reasonable range for handling both federal and state OICs. I went through this process two years ago and paid $3,800 to a tax attorney who successfully settled my $78k debt for $9,500. What really matters is the attorney's specific experience with OICs. When I was shopping around, I made the mistake of initially focusing only on price. The cheapest quote I got was $2,200, but when I dug deeper, that person had only handled about 15 OIC cases total. My final choice had over 200 OIC cases under their belt with documented success rates. A few questions to ask your attorney: How many OIC cases have they handled in the past year? What's their acceptance rate? Can they provide references from recent OIC clients? Do they have experience with cases similar to your debt amount and situation? The upfront investment might seem steep, but consider that a rejected OIC can cost you months of additional penalties and interest. Plus, you'd likely have to start over with a new professional anyway. Better to invest in proven experience from the start.
This is really helpful insight about the importance of experience over just price. I'm curious - when you were vetting attorneys, how did you verify their claimed success rates? Did they provide actual documentation or references, or did you just have to take their word for it? I'm finding that some of the professionals I'm talking to make big claims about their track record but seem reluctant to provide specifics when I ask for details.
Have you tried using the TurboTax mobile app instead? Sometimes when the web version is having server issues, the mobile app still works fine. Also, make sure you're not using any ad blockers or browser extensions that might be interfering with the e-file process. If all else fails, you can always file a paper return - just download Form 1040 from the IRS website directly.
Good point about the mobile app! I didn't even think to try that. The paper filing suggestion is smart too as a backup plan, though hopefully it doesn't come to that with the deadline approaching. Thanks for the practical alternatives!
Same exact thing happened to me yesterday! What finally worked was completely closing all browser tabs, restarting the browser entirely, and then going back to TurboTax. The blank screen seems to be some kind of session timeout issue. Also try disabling any VPN if you're using one - that was causing problems for my friend. Hope you get it sorted before the deadline!
facts. system needs a total overhaul
Freya Thomsen
Small tip for J1 physicians: when filling out Form 8843 line 4, I learned from my tax advisor that it's helpful to be specific about your J1 category. So instead of just "J-1, 01/15/2023" you might want to write "J-1 Alien Physician, 01/15/2023" to be extra clear. Also, make sure you're keeping track of all your entry/exit dates if you travel internationally during your program. This becomes really important for calculating your substantial presence test in future years!
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Omar Fawaz
ā¢Is it really necessary to specify "Alien Physician" on line 4? The form just asks for visa type and entry date. I'm worried about adding extra info if it's not required.
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Freya Thomsen
ā¢It's not absolutely required to specify "Alien Physician" - just "J-1" with the date would technically satisfy what line 4 asks for. However, my tax advisor recommended being specific because J1 physicians have different tax rules than other J1 categories. Being clear upfront can help prevent confusion if your return gets reviewed, especially since Form 8843 is specifically used to establish exempt individual status, which has special considerations for medical professionals. It's a small detail that might help avoid questions later.
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Samuel Robinson
Just wanted to add my experience as someone who went through this exact same confusion last year! For Form 8843 line 4, I ended up putting "J-1, 06/12/2022" (using my actual entry date) and it was accepted without any issues. One thing that really helped me was creating a simple timeline of all my entries and exits from the US since starting my J1 program. Even though line 4 only asks for the initial entry date, having that complete record made filling out the rest of the form much easier and helped me understand my substantial presence test status. Also, don't forget that as J1 physicians, we're considered "exempt individuals" for our first two calendar years in the US for substantial presence test purposes, which is different from other visa categories. This status affects not just Form 8843 but also how you calculate your tax residency status going forward.
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Leslie Parker
ā¢This is really helpful, thank you! I'm new to the J1 physician program and still trying to wrap my head around all these tax forms. Quick question - when you mention the "first two calendar years" for exempt individual status, does that mean if I arrived in June 2024, I'm exempt for 2024 and 2025? Or is it based on the actual 24-month period from my entry date? I want to make sure I understand this correctly for future planning.
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