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I wanted to share my experience as someone who went through a similar situation with my elderly father's medical expenses. One critical detail that helped me was understanding the "multiple support agreement" option that might apply to your situation. Since you mentioned your daughter earned $13,500, she clearly fails the gross income test for being claimed as a dependent. However, if multiple family members are contributing to her support (maybe siblings, grandparents, etc.), you might be able to use Form 2120 to designate one person to claim the medical expense deduction even if no single person provides more than 50% of her support. Also, I learned the hard way about the importance of paying providers directly rather than reimbursing your daughter. The IRS is very strict about this - if you give your daughter money and she pays the bill, you can't claim the deduction. But if you pay the provider directly (even if your daughter is present or signs forms), then you can potentially claim it. One more tip: keep detailed records not just of the payments, but also of your daughter's total support costs for the year. This includes housing, food, utilities, insurance, etc. You'll need to show that you provided more than half of her total support to meet that dependency test, even though the income test disqualifies her from being your dependent. The documentation requirements are extensive, but it's worth it if you can legitimately claim these deductions given the amounts you're dealing with.
This is incredibly helpful information about the multiple support agreement! I had no idea Form 2120 existed. In our case, it's really just my wife and I covering our daughter's expenses - no other family members are contributing significantly. But the point about paying providers directly is crucial and something I want to make sure we're handling correctly. We've been paying most bills directly to the doctors and hospitals, but there were a few instances where we gave our daughter money to cover copays or prescriptions when we couldn't be there with her. Does this mean we can't deduct those specific payments, or does the IRS look at the overall pattern of who's paying? Also, regarding the support calculation - when you say "total support costs," does this include things like her car payments, phone bill, and other living expenses that we've been covering? I'm trying to get a sense of how much documentation we'll need to gather to prove we're providing more than half her support. The medical expenses alone are substantial, but adding in all these other costs we've been covering might actually make the support test easier to meet than I initially thought.
I've been dealing with a very similar situation with my mother's medical expenses, and one thing that really helped clarify things for me was getting a consultation with a tax professional who specializes in these complex dependency situations. What I learned is that the IRS looks at each payment individually when determining who can claim the deduction. So those copays and prescriptions where you gave your daughter money to pay directly - unfortunately, those specific expenses would need to be claimed on her return if anyone is going to claim them, since she was the one who actually made the payment to the provider. However, the good news is that for the support test calculation, ALL the money you provide counts toward support - whether it's paid directly to providers or given to her for living expenses. So yes, car payments, phone bills, rent, groceries, utilities, and any other living expenses you've been covering all factor into that support calculation. Keep detailed records of everything because you'll need to show the total dollar amount of support you provided versus what she provided for herself. One strategy that worked for us going forward was to make sure we paid all medical providers directly, even if it meant calling the provider to pay over the phone or mailing checks when we couldn't be there in person. It's a bit more work, but it ensures we can claim those deductions if we meet all the other tests. The documentation requirements are indeed extensive, but given the amounts you're dealing with, it's definitely worth organizing everything properly. A spreadsheet tracking all payments by category (medical, housing, food, transportation, etc.) will be invaluable come tax time.
This is exactly the kind of detailed guidance I was hoping to find! Thank you for breaking down the payment-by-payment analysis - that makes so much more sense now. It's a bit frustrating to know we might have missed some deductions on those copays where we gave our daughter cash, but at least we know how to handle it going forward. Your point about calling providers directly to pay over the phone is really practical advice. I hadn't thought of that option, but it would definitely solve the problem of not being physically present when she needs to pay for something. Do you know if there are any issues with paying providers by phone using a credit card versus writing checks? I'm assuming as long as the payment comes directly from us to the provider, the method doesn't matter? The spreadsheet idea is brilliant - I'm definitely going to set that up to track everything going forward. It sounds like having that level of documentation will be crucial not just for claiming deductions, but also for proving the support test if we ever get audited. Given the amounts involved, I suspect our return might get flagged for review anyway, so better to be over-prepared than under-prepared. One last question - when you had your consultation with the tax professional, did they give you any sense of what percentage of returns with large medical expense deductions get audited? I'm just trying to mentally prepare for that possibility.
I completely agree with what Sasha said about addressing discrepancies sooner rather than later. As someone who's dealt with these situations professionally, I can tell you that the IRS is much more understanding when you proactively address issues rather than waiting for them to discover the problem during an audit. If your Form 4506-T transcript shows a mismatch between what you intended and what the IRS has on file, here's what I typically recommend: 1. **Small discrepancies**: If it's just that your fiscal year election didn't get properly recorded, you can often resolve this by filing Form 1128 with your next return and including a statement explaining the situation. 2. **Significant issues**: If the IRS thinks you should be filing as a calendar year entity when you've been using a fiscal year, you'll want professional help. This might require amending previous returns or filing corrective forms. 3. **Document everything**: Whatever you find, keep copies of all your original election forms, corporate documents, and any correspondence with the IRS. The good news is that most of these issues can be resolved without major penalties if you address them voluntarily. The IRS generally works with taxpayers who are making good faith efforts to comply correctly. For your immediate situation with the June 30, 2023 year-end, go ahead and file the 2022 Form 1120-S as discussed in this thread, but definitely get that transcript first to make sure you're on the same page as the IRS moving forward.
This is exactly the kind of comprehensive guidance I was hoping to find! As someone who's completely new to S-Corp fiscal year filings, the step-by-step approach you've outlined makes this much less intimidating. I'm particularly grateful for the point about documenting everything - I realize I should probably gather all my formation documents, election forms, and any IRS correspondence before requesting that transcript. It sounds like having a complete paper trail will be crucial if there are any discrepancies to resolve. One quick follow-up: when you mention filing Form 1128 "with your next return," do you mean it gets submitted alongside the 1120-S, or is it a separate filing process? I want to make sure I understand the mechanics of how to properly document any fiscal year corrections. Thanks again for sharing your professional experience - it's incredibly valuable to get insights from someone who deals with these situations regularly rather than just trying to piece together information from various IRS publications.
Form 1128 is typically filed as a separate submission to the IRS, not attached to your regular 1120-S return. You'll need to file it by the due date of the return for the year you want the change to be effective, along with the required filing fee (currently $3,020 for most businesses, though there are some exceptions for automatic changes). However, there are some situations where you might include Form 1128 information with your return - for example, if you're making an automatic accounting method change that coincides with a fiscal year change. But for most standard fiscal year elections or corrections, it's a standalone filing. The key timing consideration is that Form 1128 generally needs to be filed by the 15th day of the 5th month of the tax year you want the change to take effect. So if you're trying to establish or correct a fiscal year for your current period, you'll want to act quickly to meet the deadline. One more tip: if you're just starting out and haven't filed any returns yet under the incorrect year, sometimes you can resolve the issue more simply by ensuring your initial S-Corp election (Form 2553) properly reflects your intended fiscal year, rather than going through the Form 1128 process. The specific approach really depends on your timeline and filing history.
This has been an incredibly informative discussion! As someone who's been lurking in this community for a while but never posted, I felt compelled to jump in because I just went through this exact same situation last month. I had an S-Corp with a September 30, 2023 fiscal year end and was completely confused about which tax year to use. After reading through all the advice here about using the year when the fiscal year begins, I filed my 2022 Form 1120-S and everything went smoothly. The key insight that really clicked for me was understanding that the tax year is based on when your fiscal period starts, not ends. So my fiscal year that ran from October 1, 2022 to September 30, 2023 required the 2022 form because that's when it began. I also want to echo the advice about requesting Form 4506-T to verify how the IRS has you classified. I discovered that my fiscal year election was properly on file, which gave me confidence I was filing correctly. The transcript was really easy to request online and came back within a few days. For anyone still feeling overwhelmed by this, don't be! Once you understand the basic rule (use the year your fiscal period begins), it becomes much clearer. Just make sure your fiscal year election is properly documented with the IRS, and when in doubt, don't hesitate to verify with them directly.
One thing nobody's mentioned is that if you switch from 940/941 filing to Schedule H for future quarters/years, make sure you formally close out your 940/941 filing requirements with the IRS. Otherwise, they'll keep expecting those quarterly filings and may flag your account when they stop receiving them. You'll need to file a final 941 form for the last quarter you're using that system, and check the box indicating it's your final return. This tells the IRS you're no longer operating under that filing requirement. Then you can switch to Schedule H going forward (which is definitely simpler for most household employers).
Do you know if there's a specific form needed to close out the 940 annual filing as well? Or is the final 941 sufficient?
Yes, you'll need to handle the 940 separately. When you file your final 940 (which is an annual form due after the end of the calendar year), you should check the box in the top section that indicates you will not have to file returns in the future. The wording is something like "I will not have to file returns in the future" or similar. Make sure to do this for both forms - the final 941 for the last quarter and the 940 for the year. This proper closure ensures the IRS won't keep expecting these filings from you, which could lead to unnecessary notices or penalties down the road.
Just want to share that I went through this EXACT situation in 2023. I was filing 940/941 for my nanny all year and then realized I should've been using Schedule H. I ended up calling my local IRS Taxpayer Assistance Center and scheduling an in-person appointment (way easier than phone). The IRS rep helped me fill out my Schedule H correctly, essentially zeroing out what I owed by entering my previous payments. They also helped me submit a form to close out my 940/941 filing requirement going forward. Worth noting: they told me the 940/941 approach is actually MORE accurate technically, but Schedule H is specifically designed to simplify things for household employers. So you actually did it the "more correct but more complicated" way!
Thanks for mentioning the in-person option! I didn't know you could schedule appointments at Taxpayer Assistance Centers. How far in advance did you need to book?
I was able to book about 2 weeks out when I called, but this was during regular tax season so availability might be better at other times of year. You can find your local center and schedule online at irs.gov/help/contact-your-local-irs-office. The appointment was super helpful because they could look at my actual forms and payments in real time, rather than me trying to explain everything over the phone. They even printed out a summary of what we discussed for my records. Definitely recommend this route if you want that extra peace of mind!
Based on what you've described, it sounds like you should be able to claim your daughter as a qualifying child dependent! Since she's 20 and a full-time college student, she meets the extended age requirement (under 24 for students). Her dorm living counts as temporary absence for education - she's still considered to live with you. And if you're covering 75% of her expenses while she only earned $8,200, you're definitely providing more than half her support. Just make sure when you calculate total support, you include everything - tuition, room & board, books, food, medical expenses, transportation, etc. Her $8,200 job income needs to be less than half of that total amount. From what you've shared, it sounds like her total expenses are way more than $16,400, so you should be good! Don't forget to also look into the American Opportunity Tax Credit when you file - you can get up to $2,500 in education credits for her college expenses since you'll be claiming her as a dependent.
This is really helpful! I'm new to this whole dependent claiming thing and wasn't sure about the dorm situation. So even though my son lives on campus 8 months of the year, that still counts as living with me for tax purposes? That seems weird but I'll take it! Also good point about calculating ALL the expenses - I was only thinking about tuition but there's so much more like meal plans, textbooks, even his car insurance that I still pay. Thanks for breaking this down in simple terms!
Yes, you should definitely be able to claim your daughter as a qualifying child dependent! At 20 years old and enrolled full-time, she meets the extended age test for students (under 24). The dorm living actually works in your favor - temporary absences for education are considered as still living with you for tax purposes. The key thing to focus on is the support test. Since you're covering about 75% of her expenses and she only earned $8,200, you're clearly providing more than half her support. Just make sure when you're calculating this, you include ALL expenses: tuition, room & board, books, food, medical, transportation, personal expenses, etc. Her income needs to be less than half of that total amount. One important tip: make sure your daughter knows to check the box "Someone can claim you as a dependent" if she files her own return for that $8,200 income. She can still file to get back any taxes withheld, but she can't claim her own exemption if you're claiming her. Also don't miss out on the American Opportunity Tax Credit - you could get up to $2,500 in education credits since you'll be claiming her as a dependent and paying her college expenses. That's a significant tax benefit on top of the dependent exemption!
This is exactly the kind of clear breakdown I needed! I've been stressing about this for weeks. One follow-up question though - when you mention calculating ALL expenses, does that include things like her cell phone bill that I pay, or clothes I buy her? I want to make sure I'm not missing anything that could help prove I'm providing more than half her support. Also, should I be keeping receipts for all this stuff in case the IRS asks for documentation?
Isabella Silva
I'm having a similar issue but with a PTIN renewal rather than a new application. Has anyone successfully renewed after being locked out? My access code from last year isn't working.
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Ravi Choudhury
ā¢For PTIN renewals, try using the "Forgot Access Code" option on the PTIN system login page. Sometimes the renewal codes change yearly. If that doesn't work, call the PTIN hotline directly at 877-613-7846. I had to do this last year and they were able to help me over the phone without any notarization.
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Isabella Silva
ā¢Thanks, the "Forgot Access Code" option worked! The system sent me a new code to my email on file. Apparently the codes do expire yearly, which I didn't realize. Renewal went through without any identity verification issues after I got the new code.
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Aiden O'Connor
I went through this exact same PTIN lockout situation last month and it was incredibly stressful! Just want to reassure you that this won't affect your personal tax refund at all - the PTIN is only required if you're preparing taxes for other people as a paid preparer. For the lockout issue, I found that double-checking the exact format of how your name appears on all your documents is crucial. Sometimes it's as simple as including or excluding a middle initial, or how suffixes like "Jr." are formatted. The IRS system is very particular about exact matches. One thing that helped me was calling the PTIN hotline at 877-613-7846 during off-peak hours (early morning worked best). They can sometimes tell you what specific field is causing the mismatch without you having to go through the full paper application process. The wait times can be long, but it's worth trying before going the notarization route. Also, make sure you don't have any credit freezes in place - that was actually my issue and lifting it temporarily solved everything immediately. Hope this helps and try not to stress too much about the refund timing!
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Paolo Longo
ā¢This is such helpful advice! I'm dealing with a similar PTIN lockout situation right now and was getting really anxious about it. Quick question - when you called the PTIN hotline, were you able to get through without using a service like Claimyr? I've been trying to call for days but keep getting stuck in the automated system or disconnected after long hold times. Did you have any specific tips for navigating their phone system to actually reach a human?
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