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Do minors and felons who pay income taxes deserve representation in the tax system?

So I was talking with a friend who spent years working in government service, and we got into this interesting debate about taxation without representation. Specifically, about how certain groups like minors with part-time jobs and people who've lost voting rights still have to pay federal and state income taxes despite having no say in how those funds are used. My friend laid out the issue pretty clearly. For kids who are working part-time jobs and paying federal income taxes, they have absolutely zero representation in how those tax dollars get spent. Same goes for people who've lost their voting rights but still work and pay taxes. Seems kind of hypocritical given our whole "no taxation without representation" founding principle, right? For minors specifically, I see a few potential solutions: - Lower the voting age for those who are employed and paying income taxes - Create some kind of special representation system for taxpaying non-voters - Exempt these groups from certain taxes until they can vote I'm especially curious to hear from anyone here who's currently in this situation - maybe teens who are paying income tax on their jobs or others who pay taxes but can't vote. What do you think about this? Does it seem fair to you? Should there be changes to the system to address this disconnect between our founding principles and current practice? I'm not talking about sales tax or other consumption taxes, just focusing on state and federal income taxes.

I think people are missing an important perspective here. My teenage daughter works part-time and pays taxes. When we discussed this issue, she pointed out something interesting - she WANTS to pay into the system even without being able to vote yet. She sees it as learning financial responsibility and contributing to public services she uses like schools and roads. That said, she definitely feels there should be some mechanism for youth voices to be heard in tax policy discussions. Maybe not full voting rights at 16, but perhaps some kind of youth advisory council that provides input on how tax dollars affecting youth are spent?

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That's an interesting perspective, but how would a youth advisory council actually work? Would they have any real power or just be symbolic? And who would choose which teens get to serve on it?

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Those are good questions. I think for it to be meaningful, the council would need some actual authority - perhaps control over a small portion of the budget earmarked for youth programs, or veto power over certain spending decisions that directly impact young people. As for selection, I would suggest a combination of approaches - some members elected by high school students, others appointed based on applications and interviews to ensure diverse representation across socioeconomic backgrounds, geographic regions, etc. Maybe even have a rotating membership with 1-2 year terms so more young people get the opportunity to participate.

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Lilly Curtis

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Honestly this whole argument seems misguided to me. Teens under 18 are still being represented - by their parents or guardians who DO vote. Parents are supposed to consider their children's interests when voting. Same with the standard deduction thing - that's specifically designed to protect low-income earners, including most working teens. As for felons, losing voting rights is part of the punishment for serious crimes in many states. They knew the consequences of their actions. The "no taxation without representation" slogan was about having NO representation whatsoever. These groups still have representation, just not direct voting rights.

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Leo Simmons

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That's a really privileged perspective. Not all parents vote in their children's best interests - many vote against policies that would help their own kids based on political ideology. And regarding felons, many states now recognize that permanent disenfranchisement after serving a sentence is counterproductive to rehabilitation and reintegration. That's why so many states have restored voting rights after sentence completion.

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Gianna Scott

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Don't overthink this too much. If you're making $42k as a freelancer, just file Schedule C as a sole proprietorship. Set aside about 30% for taxes (15.3% self-employment + income tax). The only reason to consider LLC is liability protection if you're worried about being sued. S-corps are only worth the hassle when you're making closer to $100k because of the extra paperwork and costs.

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Alfredo Lugo

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This makes sense but I've heard some freelancers can reduce their tax burden significantly with the right business entity. Is sole proprietorship really the most tax efficient at $42k? Wouldn't an S-corp save on self-employment taxes?

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Gianna Scott

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At $42k in profit, an S-corp typically won't save you money because of the additional costs involved. With an S-corp, you must pay yourself a reasonable salary (subject to both employer and employee portions of FICA taxes), file separate corporate tax returns, and potentially pay for payroll services. The tax advantage of an S-corp comes from distributing some profits as dividends that aren't subject to self-employment tax. But when your profit is around $42k, a reasonable salary would likely be most or all of that amount anyway, leaving little to nothing for the tax-advantaged distributions. Plus, you'd have several hundred dollars in additional annual costs for corporate filing fees, separate tax returns, and possibly accounting services. The math usually doesn't work out favorably until you're earning significantly more.

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Important thing nobody mentioned yet: as a freelancer, you should be making QUARTERLY estimated tax payments! I learned this the hard way and got hit with penalties my first year. Since you're not having taxes withheld like with a W-2 job, the IRS expects you to pay as you earn throughout the year.

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Is there a specific form for making these quarterly payments? And what are the deadlines? I just started freelancing and haven't made any quarterly payments yet this year...

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Luca Romano

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Just as an FYI to everyone - I talked to my accountant about the credit card payment process. She said there's an option on Form 1040 called "Electronic fund withdrawal" which is different from credit card payments. This is where they'd need your bank account info. For credit card payments, you always go through the third-party processors. Also, make sure you keep your payment confirmation emails/receipts for at least 3 years with your tax records. If there's ever a question about when you paid, you'll need that proof.

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Nia Jackson

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Is there any advantage to doing the electronic withdrawal instead of credit card? The fees for credit cards seem high but I'm wondering if there's another reason people choose direct withdrawal?

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Luca Romano

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The main advantage of electronic fund withdrawal is that there are no processing fees, unlike credit card payments which charge around 2%. If you're paying a large tax bill, that 2% can add up fast. Another benefit is that with electronic withdrawal, you can schedule the payment for a future date (up to the filing deadline), while still filing your return early. This gives you more control over exactly when the money leaves your account. Credit card payments process immediately when you make them.

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Does anyone know if there's a limit to how much you can pay by credit card for taxes? I want to put about $12,000 on my card for the points but I'm worried there might be a cap.

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There are limits but they're pretty high. I think it's like 2 payments per processor, but each can be up to $99,999. So you should be fine with $12k. Just check your card's credit limit first, obviously.

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Thanks for the info! That's good to know - my credit limit is $20k so I should be fine. Gonna get so many travel points from this payment!

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Emma Taylor

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Don't overthink this. For my S-Corp I just take my quarterly profit, subtract my salary, multiply the remaining amount by my tax rate (roughly 30% for federal + state in my case), and make that payment. I use the Electronic Federal Tax Payment System (EFTPS) to pay federal and my state's tax portal for state taxes. Just remember that underpayment penalties usually don't apply if you pay 100% of last year's tax liability (or 110% if your AGI was over $150k), so that's always a safe harbor approach if you're unsure.

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PixelPioneer

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Thanks for the straightforward approach. In your experience, is it better to slightly overpay and get a refund, or try to nail the exact amount? And do you make adjustments during the year if your income fluctuates significantly?

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Emma Taylor

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I personally prefer to slightly overpay. The peace of mind is worth more to me than the interest I'd earn on that money elsewhere. I do adjust my payments throughout the year based on actual performance. Since I can see my real numbers in my accounting software, I'll recalculate before each quarterly payment. If Q1 was unusually profitable, I'll increase my Q2 payment accordingly. If business slows down, I might reduce a later payment. The key is documented methodology - as long as you can show you made a good faith effort to estimate correctly, the IRS tends to be reasonable.

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Has anyone actually used the IRS's new Direct File system for filing an S-Corp return? I heard they expanded it for 2025 filing but I'm unclear if S-corps are included.

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Direct File doesn't support business returns yet, definitely not S-Corp returns (Form 1120-S). It's still limited to pretty basic individual returns. For S-Corps you'll still need to use tax software or an accountant.

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Ruby Blake

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My experience: ALWAYS run the numbers both ways before deciding. My husband and I have been married 7 years and we've filed separately 5 times and jointly twice. It really depends on your specific situation each year. Some specific considerations in your case: - Student loan repayment plans (as others mentioned) - Potential education credits if your spouse has qualified expenses - Higher phase-out thresholds for certain deductions when filing jointly - State tax implications (some states require you to file the same status as federal) Don't just assume one way is always better!

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Do you use special software to calculate both scenarios? Seems like it would be time-consuming to do everything twice.

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Ruby Blake

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I use TurboTax and it has a feature that lets you compare filing jointly vs. separately. Most of the major tax software options have this comparison tool built in. You basically enter all your information once, and then it shows you the difference in refund/amount owed for both filing statuses. It takes maybe an extra 15-20 minutes to review both scenarios, but it's definitely worth it when you discover a difference of several hundred or even thousands of dollars. In our case, we've saved over $12,000 across those 7 years by choosing the optimal filing status each year rather than just defaulting to one option.

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Ella Harper

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You mentioned your spouse has substantial student loans - are they federal or private? If federal and they're on an income-based repayment plan (or planning to apply for one), this is HUGELY important in your decision. Filing separately might mean much lower monthly payments since they'd only count your spouse's income (which you said is zero). But there's a tradeoff - you might lose some tax benefits when filing separately like education credits, higher standard deduction, and better tax brackets. Run the numbers both ways!

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PrinceJoe

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This is so important! My wife and I saved over $4k last year by filing separately specifically because of her federal student loans on IBR. The tax hit was about $1800 more filing separately, but her monthly payments dropped by $450 per month which saved us $5400 for the year.

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