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Has anybody here actually gone through the full SS-8 process from filing to determination? Everything I've read online suggests it takes forever to get a ruling. I'm wondering if it's even worth it or if I should just suck it up and pay the self-employment taxes to avoid the hassle?
I filed an SS-8 in early 2023 and finally got my determination in November - so about 9 months. The IRS ruled in my favor and determined I was an employee. My former "client" had to pay back taxes, and I got a refund for the excess self-employment tax I had paid. The process was definitely slow but totally worth it in my case since I got back around $4500. I used code G on Form 8919 when I initially filed my taxes, so I only paid the employee portion while waiting for the determination.
I'm dealing with a very similar situation right now - got misclassified by an employer who had me working set hours at their location using their equipment, but they issued a 1099 instead of a W-2. The self-employment tax burden is crushing! From what I've researched, you definitely have a strong case for employee classification based on the IRS's common law test. The fact that both employers controlled when, where, and how you worked are major red flags for misclassification. I'd recommend filing the SS-8 and 8919 together rather than waiting. Even though the SS-8 determination takes months, you can use code G on Form 8919 to indicate you're filing it along with an SS-8. This way you only pay the employee portion of Social Security and Medicare taxes (7.65%) instead of the full 15.3% self-employment tax while you wait for the determination. If the IRS rules in your favor on the SS-8 (which sounds likely given your situation), your former employers will be on the hook for their portion of the employment taxes plus penalties. You might even get a refund if you initially paid more than the employee portion. Don't let these employers get away with shifting their tax burden onto you - file those forms and protect yourself!
This is such valuable advice! I'm actually in the exact same boat as the original poster and had no idea about using code G on Form 8919 when filing with SS-8 simultaneously. That detail about only paying 7.65% vs 15.3% while waiting for determination could save me thousands. One question - if I file the 8919 with code G and later the SS-8 determination goes against me (saying I really was an independent contractor), would I then owe the difference in self-employment taxes plus penalties? Or is there some protection for good faith filings based on reasonable belief of misclassification? Also, has anyone had success getting their former employers to voluntarily correct the classification before going through the formal SS-8 process? I'm wondering if showing them the potential penalties might motivate them to issue corrected W-2s instead.
Great question about the potential consequences if the SS-8 determination goes against you. From what I understand, if the IRS ultimately rules that you were properly classified as an independent contractor, you would indeed owe the difference between what you paid (employee portion at 7.65%) and what you should have paid (full self-employment tax at 15.3%). However, there typically aren't penalties for good faith filings when you have a reasonable basis for believing you were misclassified. The key is having solid documentation to support your position - things like emails showing they controlled your schedule, evidence you used their equipment, lack of ability to work for competitors, etc. The IRS looks at the totality of the working relationship. As for getting employers to voluntarily correct - I've seen it happen but it's pretty rare. Most employers resist because they'd have to pay their portion of employment taxes retroactively plus potential penalties. That said, it might be worth one polite attempt before filing the SS-8, especially if you can frame it as helping them avoid larger penalties down the road. Just be prepared that they'll likely refuse and you'll need to proceed with the formal process.
As someone who's been driving for rideshare for about 8 months now, I can definitely relate to the confusion! Here's what I learned the hard way: Keep EVERYTHING organized from day one. I use a simple spreadsheet to track all my expenses weekly - it takes maybe 10 minutes but saves hours during tax time. For your specific situation with 30 hours/week driving, you're probably looking at around 70-80% business use on your vehicle. Run the numbers on both methods, but with a newer leased vehicle like your Camry, standard mileage often comes out ahead. One thing I wish someone had told me: those car washes are 100% deductible as a business expense if you're doing them specifically for rideshare (which it sounds like you are with 2x weekly). Same with your phone mount, charger cables, and any passenger amenities. Also - and this is crucial - start making quarterly estimated tax payments NOW. I got hit with a penalty my first year because I waited until tax season. The IRS expects you to pay as you go when you're self-employed. Set up a separate savings account and automatically transfer 25-30% of your rideshare earnings there. Trust me on this one - April will come faster than you think!
This is such helpful advice! I'm also new to rideshare driving and had no idea about quarterly estimated payments. How do you calculate how much to pay each quarter? Is it based on what you made in the previous quarter or do you have to estimate your whole year's income upfront? And when are the quarterly deadlines? I don't want to get hit with penalties like you did!
Great question @Malik Johnson! For quarterly estimated taxes, you have a few options for calculating: 1. **Safe Harbor Rule**: Pay 100% of last year's total tax liability (110% if your prior year AGI was over $150k). Since you're new to self-employment, this might not apply. 2. **Current Year Estimate**: Estimate your annual rideshare income, calculate the taxes owed, and divide by 4. I use a rough formula: (Net rideshare income Γ 0.153 for SE tax) + (Net income Γ your tax bracket rate). 3. **Pay-as-you-go**: Calculate based on actual quarterly earnings - this is what I do now since rideshare income can be unpredictable. The 2025 quarterly due dates are: - Q1 (Jan-Mar): April 15, 2025 - Q2 (Apr-May): June 16, 2025 - Q3 (Jun-Aug): September 15, 2025 - Q4 (Sep-Dec): January 15, 2026 You can make payments online at irs.gov/payments or use Form 1040ES. I set calendar reminders a week before each deadline. Even if you're slightly off on your estimates, paying something quarterly shows good faith and usually avoids penalties!
One thing that might help you decide between standard mileage vs actual expenses - keep detailed records for both methods for the first few months, then compare. Since you're driving 30+ hours weekly in a leased vehicle, the standard mileage rate ($0.67/mile for 2025) might actually work out better, especially if you're putting on a lot of miles. A few additional deductible expenses I didn't see mentioned: - Hand sanitizer and cleaning supplies (became huge during COVID and still relevant) - Parking fees when waiting for rides - Background check fees that Uber/Lyft charge annually - Portion of your auto insurance deductible if you have an accident while driving For record keeping, I'd suggest taking photos of all receipts and storing them in Google Drive or similar. Credit card statements help, but the IRS really wants to see itemized receipts showing what you bought and when. Since you mentioned spending $280-350/week on gas, you're probably driving 1,200+ miles weekly. At the standard rate, that's potentially $800+ in weekly deductions just from mileage. Definitely run those numbers! Also consider getting a business credit card just for rideshare expenses - makes tracking so much easier come tax time.
This is really solid advice! I'm just getting started with rideshare myself and the math on standard mileage is pretty compelling. At $0.67/mile, even if I'm only doing 800-900 miles per week, that's still around $500-600 in weekly deductions versus trying to track every single expense. The business credit card tip is genius - I've been mixing everything on my personal card and it's already becoming a nightmare to sort through. Did you find any specific cards that work better for rideshare drivers? Also, how do you handle the business vs personal split when you use the same card for both? One question about the background check fees - do those get deducted in the year you pay them or spread out over the period they cover? Uber just charged me $25 for the annual renewal and I wasn't sure how to categorize it.
I went through something very similar last year - had the 420 code appear on my transcript in September but didn't receive the actual audit letter until mid-November. The IRS mail system is incredibly slow right now, especially if there are any address issues. One thing that helped me was pulling my wage and income transcript (not just the account transcript) to see if there were any discrepancies between what I reported and what third parties reported to the IRS. Sometimes audits are triggered by mismatches that aren't immediately obvious. Given that you moved twice in 2022, I'd strongly recommend calling the IRS practitioner priority line (if you have representation) or using one of the callback services mentioned in other comments. The address issue could mean your audit letter is sitting in limbo somewhere, and missing the response deadline could turn a simple correspondence audit into something much more complicated. Also, keep in mind that the NIIT adjustment being in your favor doesn't necessarily mean it was correct - the IRS computers make automatic adjustments all the time that later get reviewed by humans. I'd definitely have your investment income documentation ready along with your home office records.
This is really helpful, thank you! I didn't know about the wage and income transcript - I've only been looking at my account transcript. How do I access that specifically? And what kinds of mismatches should I be looking for? I'm trying to prepare as thoroughly as possible while I wait for the actual letter to arrive.
You can access your wage and income transcript through the same IRS online account where you found the 420 code. When you're logged in, look for "Get Transcript" and select "Wage and Income Transcript" for tax year 2022. This shows all the forms (W-2s, 1099s, etc.) that third parties filed with the IRS for you. Look for any differences between what's on that transcript versus what you actually reported on your return. Common mismatches include: 1099-MISC income you might have missed, incorrect Social Security numbers on forms, or business income reported under a different classification than you used. Even small discrepancies can trigger an audit flag. Since you run a consulting business, pay special attention to any 1099-NEC forms - sometimes clients file these late or with errors that don't match your records. Also check if there are any investment-related forms (1099-DIV, 1099-INT) that might relate to your NIIT situation.
I've been through a similar situation and can offer some reassurance. The 420 code with an August date means the examination was initiated then, but the IRS correspondence process is extremely backed up right now. You could easily be looking at 60-90 days before receiving the actual letter, especially with your address changes. A few practical suggestions based on my experience: 1. **Address verification is critical** - File Form 8822 immediately if you haven't already. Even if you think your address is current, the IRS often has outdated information that can delay or misdirect correspondence. 2. **The NIIT adjustment is likely the trigger** - In my case, any time the IRS made an adjustment in my favor (even automatically), it got flagged for human review later. The system probably corrected what it thought was an error, but now an examiner wants to verify the calculation was actually correct. 3. **Document everything now** - Gather your 2022 investment statements, Form 8960 worksheets if you filed one, and any supporting documents for the NIIT calculation. Also prepare your home office documentation just in case, but I'd bet money it's the NIIT issue. 4. **Don't panic about timing** - Even if the letter is delayed, the IRS is generally reasonable about response deadlines when there are mail delivery issues, especially if you can document when you actually received it. The waiting is the worst part, but you're being proactive by preparing now. Most correspondence audits are resolved pretty quickly once you provide the requested documentation.
Something important that hasn't been mentioned yet - even if you can't deduct the mortgage interest, make sure you're tracking these payments carefully for potential future tax benefits. If your brother eventually sells the house at a profit, your contributions could affect the calculations. Also, have you considered refinancing so you're added to the deed? That would solve the deduction problem going forward, though it might trigger transfer taxes depending on your state. Another option might be drawing up a formal loan agreement between you and your sibling, which could potentially convert some of your payments into loan interest that might be reportable differently.
Adding to this great advice - if you refinance to add yourself to the deed, be aware this can create a "gift" in the other direction too. If the property has appreciated since purchase and you're added as 50% owner without paying for that equity, the IRS could consider that a gift from your sibling to you. It gets complicated fast!
One thing I don't see mentioned yet is the potential state tax implications. While federal law is pretty clear about needing both legal liability AND ownership for the mortgage interest deduction, some states have different rules or additional deductions that might apply to your situation. For example, some states allow deductions for property taxes paid on behalf of family members, or have specific provisions for co-signers who make payments due to the primary borrower's financial hardship. Since you mentioned your brother lost his job and had medical issues, this could potentially qualify as hardship in certain states. I'd recommend checking your state's tax code or consulting with a local tax professional who knows your state's specific rules. The federal restrictions don't necessarily mean you're out of options entirely - there might be state-level benefits you can claim even if the federal mortgage interest deduction isn't available. Also, keep detailed records of which payments went to principal vs. interest vs. escrow (taxes/insurance). Even if you can't use the mortgage interest now, this documentation could be valuable for other tax situations down the road.
This is really helpful advice about checking state-specific rules! I hadn't even thought about the possibility that state tax laws might be different from federal. Do you happen to know if there's an easy way to research state tax codes, or would I need to contact my state's tax department directly? Also, regarding keeping detailed records of principal vs interest vs escrow - I've been getting monthly statements from the mortgage company, but they're addressed to my brother since the loan is in his name. Would copies of those statements be sufficient documentation, or do I need something more official showing that I was the one who actually made the payments?
Alexander Zeus
Don't forget about self-employment tax! On $105k of net income, your SE tax alone will be around $14,800 (15.3% of 92.35% of your net income). That's ON TOP of your income tax. This is the part that shocked me my first year freelancing. I had saved for income tax but completely forgot that I now had to pay both sides of Social Security and Medicare. Make sure you're calculating your quarterly payments including BOTH income tax AND self-employment tax!
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Alicia Stern
β’Does the self employment tax apply even if I max out social security contributions at my W-2 job? I have both W-2 and 1099 income.
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Maya Diaz
β’Good question! If you already maxed out Social Security through your W-2 job ($160,200 for 2023), then the Social Security portion (12.4%) won't apply to your 1099 income. However, you'll still owe the Medicare portion (2.9%) on all your self-employment income, plus the additional 0.9% Medicare tax if your total income exceeds $200k ($250k if married filing jointly). So in your case, you'd pay about 2.9% SE tax on your 1099 income instead of the full 15.3%. Just make sure to account for this when calculating your quarterly payments - it's still a significant amount that catches people off guard!
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Connor O'Neill
Just to add another perspective - I'm a freelance graphic designer and was in a similar situation last year with around $120k in 1099 income. Here's what I learned the hard way: The penalty isn't just about the percentage - it's also about cash flow. Even if you're willing to pay a penalty, having to come up with $25,000-30,000 all at once in April can be brutal. I thought I had enough saved, but then had some unexpected expenses in March and suddenly scrambling to pay my tax bill was incredibly stressful. What worked for me was setting up automatic transfers to a separate "tax account" every time I got paid. I transfer 30% immediately - covers both income tax and self-employment tax with a small buffer. Then I make the quarterly payments from that account. Takes the guesswork and stress out of it. Also, don't forget that if you end up owing more than $1,000 when you file, you might be required to make estimated payments the following year regardless. So you might as well get into the habit now rather than dealing with penalties and scrambling later.
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Aiden Chen
β’This is really solid advice about the cash flow aspect! I'm new to freelancing and hadn't thought about how stressful it would be to suddenly need $25k+ in April. The automatic transfer idea sounds perfect - takes the decision-making out of it each time you get paid. Quick question though - do you transfer the 30% based on your gross 1099 income or after business expenses? I'm trying to figure out if I should be setting aside money before I pay for things like equipment, software subscriptions, etc.
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