Does pension count as income for Social Security survivors benefits or ex-spouse benefits?

The pension itself doesn't count toward the earnings limit for Social Security, but it does matter for different reasons. Your situation involves two different rules: 1. For survivor benefits: The Government Pension Offset (GPO) will likely reduce your survivor benefits by 2/3 of your government pension amount. So if your pension is $3,250/month, your survivor benefit would be reduced by about $2,167/month. 2. For ex-spouse benefits: The same GPO rules apply here too - any spousal or ex-spousal benefits would be reduced by 2/3 of your pension. The earnings limit you're thinking of only applies to wages or self-employment income before you reach full retirement age, not to pension income.

pension doesnt count for earning limit but watch out for the gpo thing the other person said. my mom got hit with that and barely got anything from dad's ss when he died because of her teacher pension. really messed up her plans

Your pension won't count toward the annual earnings limit, but since it's from a government job where you didn't pay Social Security taxes, you're going to face both potential WEP and GPO issues. WEP (Windfall Elimination Provision) will likely reduce any retirement benefit based on your own Social Security record. GPO (Government Pension Offset) will reduce any survivor benefits or spousal benefits by 2/3 of your government pension. You should definitely schedule an appointment with SSA to go over your specific situation before making any decisions. These offset provisions can dramatically change what you'll actually receive.

I was in a similar situation with my state pension and wanting to claim on my late husband's record. Let me tell you - trying to get accurate information from SSA was IMPOSSIBLE. I spent months calling, getting disconnected, and receiving conflicting information. Finally someone told me about Claimyr (claimyr.com) which got me connected to an actual SSA agent within 20 minutes instead of the hours I was spending on hold. They have a video showing how it works here: https://youtu.be/Z-BRbJw3puU The agent I spoke with was able to run calculations showing exactly how GPO would affect my survivor benefits with my specific pension amount. Turns out I was still eligible for about $450/month in survivor benefits even after the reduction, which I wouldn't have known without getting the exact calculation.

my friend just went thru this! the pension only matters for the WEP/GPO stuff not the earnings limit. the earnings limit is only for actual work income like if u have a job or business. but ya the GPO will probably wipe out most of ur survivor benefits sadly

I had to figure all this out last year. Soooo confusing! What no one tells you is that you should look at your PRIMARY INSURANCE AMOUNT on your own record versus what you'd get as a survivor after the GPO reduction. For me, my own benefit was actually higher even after WEP reduced it! The only way to know for sure is to ask SSA to run both calculations.

To address your follow-up question: Yes, the Windfall Elimination Provision (WEP) would likely affect your own retirement benefits based on your SS-covered work. However, since you mentioned working 15 years in jobs that paid into Social Security, you might qualify for the "substantial earnings" exception that reduces the WEP penalty. The formula is complex, but the good news is that having 20+ years of "substantial earnings" under Social Security can significantly reduce the WEP reduction, and having 30+ years eliminates it entirely. Your best approach is to: 1. Create a my.ssa.gov account if you haven't already 2. Download your complete earnings record 3. Schedule a consultation with SSA to calculate your potential benefits under all scenarios (own record with WEP, survivor benefits with GPO, ex-spouse benefits with GPO) 4. Compare these options to determine the best filing strategy The timing of when you claim each type of benefit can make a significant difference in your lifetime total.

Just wondering did ur government job let u pay into medicare? Sometimes people with government pensions still have to figure out medicare separately which is another headache

Just want to add another perspective - if you're considering working part-time after 62, remember that your pension income won't count toward the earnings limit, but any wages will. The earnings limit for 2025 is $23,400 if you're under full retirement age. So you could potentially work part-time AND collect reduced Social Security benefits without your pension affecting that calculation. However, as others mentioned, the GPO will still reduce any survivor or spousal benefits regardless of whether you're working or not. It's worth running the numbers on all scenarios - sometimes claiming your own benefit early plus working part-time can be better than waiting for survivor benefits that get heavily reduced by GPO.

The break-even calculation depends on several variables, but here's a rough framework to think about it: Let's say your survivor benefit before GPO is $2,000/month. With your $3,250 pension, GPO reduces it by $2,167, leaving you with potentially $0 (GPO can't reduce below zero, but it often eliminates the entire benefit). Now compare that to: - Your own reduced SS benefit at 62 (maybe $1,200-1,500/month depending on your earnings record and WEP) - Plus part-time earnings up to $23,400/year ($1,950/month) - Plus your $3,250 pension That combination could give you $6,200-6,700/month total versus potentially just your $3,250 pension if GPO wipes out survivor benefits. The key is getting SSA to calculate your actual numbers. Also remember that if you take your own benefit early, it's permanently reduced, but you can potentially switch to higher survivor benefits at full retirement age if they end up being more beneficial after GPO. Definitely worth modeling different scenarios with actual SSA calculations rather than estimates!

I'm also dealing with government pension and Social Security questions, so this thread has been incredibly helpful! One thing I wanted to add that might help you - when you're calculating the potential scenarios, don't forget to factor in COLA (cost of living adjustments). Social Security benefits get annual COLA increases, but many government pensions have limited or no COLA adjustments. Over time, this can make a significant difference in your purchasing power. For example, if your state pension stays flat at $3,250 while Social Security benefits increase 2-3% annually, that gap widens every year. Also, if you do decide to work part-time while collecting Social Security, remember that those earnings will continue to add to your Social Security earnings record, potentially increasing your future benefits through what SSA calls "recomputation of benefits." The strategy of taking reduced benefits early plus part-time work that others mentioned could actually help boost your long-term Social Security benefits while giving you more current income than waiting for GPO-reduced survivor benefits. Definitely something to discuss when you get those SSA calculations done!

This is such a complex situation, and I really appreciate everyone sharing their experiences! I'm in a similar boat with a teacher's pension and trying to navigate these same decisions. One thing I learned from my financial planner that might help - when you're comparing all these scenarios, also consider the tax implications. Your government pension is likely fully taxable, while Social Security benefits might only be partially taxable depending on your total income. This could affect which strategy gives you the most after-tax income. Also, if you're considering part-time work, think about whether you could do contract or consulting work related to your government experience. Sometimes that type of work pays well enough that even with the earnings limit, you might come out ahead compared to traditional part-time employment. The suggestion about using Claimyr to actually get through to SSA sounds like a lifesaver - I've been putting off those phone calls because I know how frustrating they can be. Has anyone else used that service successfully?

This is such a valuable discussion! I'm currently helping my mother navigate similar pension/Social Security decisions, and the complexity is overwhelming. One thing I want to emphasize that I learned through our experience: the timing of when you file for different benefits can be just as important as which benefits you choose. For example, you might be able to file a restricted application for survivor benefits while letting your own retirement benefit grow with delayed retirement credits until age 70, then switch if your own benefit becomes higher. However, this strategy depends on your specific birth year and the rule changes that took effect in 2016. Since you're turning 62 next month, you may still have some of these options available that younger people don't. Also, something to keep in mind - if your late husband had already started collecting Social Security before he passed, your potential survivor benefit is based on what he was actually receiving (including any reductions if he claimed early). But if he hadn't claimed yet, it would be based on his full benefit amount. This could significantly impact your calculations. The GPO reduction is harsh, but sometimes there's still a small survivor benefit left after the 2/3 reduction. Even $200-300/month could be meaningful over time with COLA increases. Don't assume it will be completely eliminated without getting the actual calculation from SSA. Good luck with your decision - this is one of the most complex areas of Social Security law!

I've been following this thread closely as someone who works with Social Security claims regularly, and I want to emphasize a few critical points that could save you thousands of dollars in the long run. First, regarding the timing strategy mentioned - you're absolutely right that birth year matters for restricted applications. If you were born before January 2, 1954, you still have access to some claiming strategies that were grandfathered in. This could allow you to claim survivor benefits first while letting your own retirement benefit grow until age 70. Second, I want to stress the importance of getting multiple calculations from SSA. Ask them to show you: - Your own retirement benefit at 62, FRA, and 70 (with WEP applied) - Survivor benefits with GPO reduction at different claiming ages - Ex-spousal benefits with GPO reduction - The "break-even" ages for each strategy Third, don't overlook the Medicare implications. Since you mentioned paying Medicare taxes in your government job, you're covered there, but the timing of when you claim Social Security can affect Medicare Part B premium costs due to IRMAA (Income-Related Monthly Adjustment Amount) thresholds. The strategy of taking your own reduced benefit at 62 plus part-time work could indeed be optimal, especially given that your pension has no COLA while Social Security does. Just make sure any part-time work won't push you over the IRMAA thresholds for Medicare premiums. This is definitely a situation where getting professional help - either through SSA directly or a fee-only financial planner who specializes in Social Security - could pay for itself many times over.

I've been working as a Social Security disability attorney for over a decade, and I can tell you that cases involving government pensions are some of the most complex I see. Your situation is actually more common than you might think, and while the WEP/GPO rules are frustrating, there are still strategies to optimize your benefits. One thing I haven't seen mentioned yet is the importance of understanding exactly how your pension is structured. Some state pension systems have portions that DID pay into Social Security (like if you had any federal employment or if your state system changed over time). If any portion of your pension comes from SS-covered employment, that could affect the GPO calculation. Also, regarding your ex-spouse benefits - make sure to verify that your ex-spouse is still living and hasn't remarried before age 60 (which would affect your eligibility). The 12-year marriage length is good since it exceeds the 10-year requirement, but there are other eligibility factors to confirm. I'd strongly recommend bringing copies of ALL your pension documents, marriage certificates, divorce decree, and your late husband's death certificate to your SSA appointment. The more documentation you have upfront, the more accurate their calculations will be. Given the complexity and the significant financial impact over your lifetime, this might also be worth a consultation with a Social Security attorney who handles retirement planning, not just disability cases. Many of us offer free consultations for retirement benefit optimization.