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14 Going back to the original question about hobby vs self-employed income, one thing nobody's mentioned is the self-employment tax. If you file as self-employed, you'll pay an additional 15.3% tax on your net profit for Social Security and Medicare. For hobby income, you don't pay this tax. With your small amount of income, the self-employment tax might actually cost you more than what you save from deducting the developer fee. Run the numbers both ways before deciding.
1 I hadn't even considered the self-employment tax! That's a really good point. If I go the self-employed route, I'd be paying 15.3% on the profit after expenses. But if I go the hobby route, I'd pay regular income tax on the full $160 without being able to deduct the $125 developer fee. Let me see... If I file as self-employed, my profit would be $160 - $125 = $35, and I'd pay 15.3% on that plus my regular income tax rate. If I file as a hobby, I'd pay just my regular income tax on the full $160. Hmm, this actually makes the hobby route seem better financially in my case. I need to calculate this more precisely. Thanks for pointing this out!
14 You're welcome! That's exactly the kind of calculation you should be doing. Just to add one more thing: remember that with self-employment, you can deduct half of the self-employment tax from your income. That helps a little. Also, if you think your app income might grow in the future, establishing it as a business now could be beneficial long-term, especially for building retirement savings through a SEP IRA or solo 401(k) once the income justifies it. Just something to keep in mind if you see potential for this to grow beyond covering just the developer fee.
7 Has anyone used TurboTax for this kind of situation? I have a similar issue with small YouTube ad revenue, and I'm wondering if TurboTax handles this well or if I should use something else.
19 I used TurboTax for my Etsy shop income last year (about $500). It handled both options fine, but I found the questions for the Schedule C to be easier to follow than trying to figure out where to put hobby income. They walk you through the business vs. hobby test and help you choose which approach makes sense.
Another option nobody mentioned is FreeTaxUSA. I used it to e-file my 2019 amended return last year and it worked great. Their interface for the 1040-X is actually clearer than TurboTax in my opinion, and it's WAY cheaper. The one drawback is you need to have your original return info handy and enter it manually - they don't import from PDFs like some of the other options mentioned. But if you're looking to save money and still want to e-file your 2019 amendment, it's worth checking out.
Do you remember approximately how long it took for the IRS to process your e-filed 1040-X through FreeTaxUSA? I've heard horror stories about paper amendments taking 6+ months, wondering if e-filing is significantly faster.
It took about 7 weeks from submission to getting my refund, which was significantly faster than paper filing. The IRS sent an acknowledgment of receipt within 2 days of e-filing, which gave me peace of mind that they actually had my amendment. From what I've heard, paper amendments are taking 6-12 months right now, so e-filing is definitely the way to go if you qualify. Just make sure your changes are for forms that support e-filing - not all schedules can be e-filed for amendments even now.
Hate to be the bearer of bad news, but if you're trying to amend a 2019 return NOW for additional refund, you're probably out of luck. The deadline for claiming refunds from 2019 was generally April 18, 2023 (3 years from the original due date). I learned this the hard way when I tried to claim some missed education credits from 2019 earlier this year. Unless you have a special situation (military deployment, natural disaster victim, etc.), the IRS won't issue refunds for amendments filed after the 3-year window closes.
Actually this isn't always true. If you've had tax payments applied to the year in question after filing (like estimated tax payments that were applied forward or carryforwards from other years), the deadline can be extended to 2 years from the date of the last payment rather than 3 years from filing. Worth checking if this applies to your situation OP.
For what it's worth, I've been doing my duplex taxes on my own using FreeTaxUSA for the past three years. It's WAY cheaper than TurboTax but still handles Schedule E for rentals perfectly fine. I was paying $500+ to a CPA before that, but realized my situation is pretty straightforward. The software walks you through all the rental income, expenses, and depreciation stuff step by step.
Does FreeTaxUSA handle state taxes too? And is it easy to import previous year's info if you're switching from TurboTax?
FreeTaxUSA does handle state taxes, though unlike federal (which is free), there's a small fee for state filing - around $15 depending on your state. Way cheaper than TurboTax's $50+ for state filing. As for importing from TurboTax, unfortunately, you can't directly import the TurboTax file. You'll need to manually enter your information the first year. However, it's not as bad as it sounds since you can use your previous year's return as a guide. After that first year, FreeTaxUSA will remember your info and make future years much easier.
Honestly, with just a single rental unit in a duplex, TurboTax should be fine. I've used it for 5 years with my triplex (live in one, rent two). Just make sure you keep good records of your expenses and know which ones need to be split between personal and rental use. The only time I'd pay for a professional is if you have multiple properties or complicated situations like 1031 exchanges.
What deductions are people commonly missing with rental properties? I always worry I'm leaving money on the table even with TurboTax.
For the original poster, one thing I haven't seen mentioned is filing Form 911 (Taxpayer Advocate Service request). When you have documentation that proves you're correct but keep getting the runaround, the Taxpayer Advocate can intervene. They're an independent organization within the IRS designed to help taxpayers resolve issues that normal channels can't fix. The service is completely free and they have the authority to cut through red tape. In situations with multiple conflicting explanations like yours, they're often the fastest path to resolution.
I've never heard of Form 911 or the Taxpayer Advocate Service. Is this something anyone can use? And how long does it typically take to get a response from them?
Yes, anyone can request help from the Taxpayer Advocate Service, though they prioritize cases where taxpayers are experiencing financial hardship, immediate threats of adverse action, or situations where they've tried normal IRS channels without success - which definitely applies to your case. Response times vary greatly depending on their caseload and the complexity of your situation. Currently they're taking about 4-6 weeks for initial response, but they can place holds on collections while they investigate. The best part is you'll get assigned a specific advocate who handles your case personally, so you're not explaining your situation to a different person every time. You can find the form and contact information on the IRS website by searching "Taxpayer Advocate Service.
Has anyone considered the possibility that you might actually owe the taxes? I'm not trying to be rude, but the IRS doesn't usually make things up completely. Maybe check if there was income reported on a 1099 or W-2 that you forgot about? Sometimes employers or banks submit forms you never received.
This is actually a good point. I once had a similar issue and it turned out a former employer had submitted a corrected W-2 that showed $2k more income than the original one I received. I never got the corrected copy but the IRS did! Worth checking your wage and income transcript too.
Isabella Ferreira
For your college assignment, don't forget about the passive activity loss limitations on Schedule E. This is something that often trips up students (and sometimes even professionals!). If your fictional taxpayer has a loss from the rental property, they might not be able to deduct the full amount depending on their income level. For 2017 specifically, if their modified adjusted gross income was under $100,000, they could deduct up to $25,000 of rental losses. This deduction phases out between $100,000-$150,000 of MAGI. If they made over $150,000, generally they couldn't deduct any losses that year (they'd be carried forward instead).
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Paolo Ricci
ā¢Thank you for mentioning this! My fictional taxpayer has an AGI of $123,000, so they'd be in that phaseout range. How exactly do I calculate the deductible portion of the $7,500 rental loss in this case? Is there a specific worksheet in the instructions?
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Isabella Ferreira
ā¢For an AGI of $123,000, you're right in the middle of the phaseout range. The calculation is pretty straightforward: you lose $0.50 of the $25,000 maximum deduction for every $1 over $100,000. So take $123,000 - $100,000 = $23,000 over the threshold. Multiply that by 0.5 = $11,500 reduction. This means your maximum deduction would be $25,000 - $11,500 = $13,500. Since your loss is only $7,500, you can deduct the entire amount because it's less than your modified maximum. Form 8582 is where you'd calculate this for a real return, but for your assignment, just showing this calculation should be sufficient unless your professor specifically required Form 8582 as part of the project.
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Ravi Sharma
Just wondering, what tax software are you using for this assignment? When I took my tax class we used an older version of TaxAct that the school provided, but it was super glitchy with the 2017 forms.
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NebulaNomad
ā¢Our professor had us use the free fillable PDFs from the IRS website for older tax years. Way less headache than dealing with outdated software! You can still download the 2017 forms and instructions directly from irs.gov/prior-year
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