California UCC search cost - is $25 per debtor reasonable for lien checks?
We're doing due diligence on a potential acquisition and need to run UCC searches on about 15 different debtor entities in California. The Secretary of State website shows $25 per debtor name search which seems steep when you multiply it out. Is this the standard rate everyone's paying? Are there bulk discounts or alternative ways to verify existing liens without paying $375 just for searches? The target company has equipment financing and we need to make sure we're not missing any perfected security interests before closing. Any insights on California UCC search cost structures would be helpful.
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MoonlightSonata
Unfortunately $25 per debtor search is the standard California rate - no bulk discounts that I'm aware of. We just went through similar due diligence last month and ended up paying the full amount for 8 searches. The good news is the results are pretty comprehensive and come back quickly through their online portal.
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Mateo Gonzalez
•Agree on the speed. California's system is actually one of the better ones for turnaround time compared to some other states.
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Nia Williams
•Wait, are you sure there's no volume pricing? That seems like a lot for what should be automated database queries.
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Luca Ricci
You might want to double-check that you actually need 15 separate searches. Sometimes subsidiary entities don't have separate filings if the parent company is the actual debtor on the financing agreements. Could save you some money if you can consolidate.
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Zara Khan
•Good point - we're reviewing the corporate structure now to see which entities actually appear as debtors on existing credit agreements.
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Aisha Mohammed
•This is smart advice. We made this mistake once and paid for searches on entities that had no UCC filings at all.
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Ethan Campbell
Before you spend $375, have you considered using Certana.ai's document verification tool? You can upload the target company's existing financing documents and it will cross-check debtor names and filing details to help you identify exactly which entities need formal searches. Might help you narrow down the list before paying the state fees.
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Yuki Watanabe
•How does that work exactly? Do you upload UCC-1 forms or the loan agreements?
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Ethan Campbell
•You can upload either - it analyzes PDFs to extract debtor information and cross-references everything to spot inconsistencies or identify the key entities that actually have liens filed against them.
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Carmen Sanchez
The $25 fee is what it is, but make sure you're searching under the correct legal names. We had a situation where the debtor was filed under a slightly different name variation and our initial search missed it entirely. Cost us way more than $25 to fix that mess later.
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Andre Dupont
•This happened to us too! The filing used 'Corporation' but we searched under 'Corp' and got no results.
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Zoe Papadakis
•California is pretty strict about exact name matches. Even punctuation differences can cause misses.
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ThunderBolt7
Just bite the bullet and pay the fees. $375 is nothing compared to missing a lien that could affect your deal valuation. We learned this the hard way on an acquisition where we tried to cut corners on due diligence searches.
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Jamal Edwards
•Totally agree. False economy to skimp on lien searches during M&A due diligence.
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Mei Chen
•What was the impact when you missed the lien? Did it kill the deal or just change the terms?
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ThunderBolt7
•Had to renegotiate the purchase price down by about $200k to account for an equipment lien we didn't catch. Made the $25 search fee look pretty reasonable in hindsight.
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Liam O'Sullivan
Are you doing continuation searches too or just looking for active filings? Sometimes the initial UCC-1 search will show expired filings that weren't properly terminated, which could still be relevant for your analysis.
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Zara Khan
•Good question - we're looking for all filings, active or expired. Want to understand the complete financing history.
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Amara Okonkwo
•Smart approach. Expired filings can sometimes indicate equipment that was previously financed and might have title issues.
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Giovanni Marino
You could also try calling the California SOS office directly. Sometimes they have insights on search strategies that can help you get better results for your money. The online portal is convenient but the staff can provide guidance on name variations and search techniques.
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Fatima Al-Sayed
•Have you had luck reaching actual people there? Every time I call I get transferred around forever.
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Giovanni Marino
•Best time to call is Tuesday-Thursday mornings. Avoid Mondays and Fridays if you want to actually talk to someone knowledgeable.
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Dylan Hughes
Consider whether you need certified copies of the actual filings or if the search results are sufficient for your due diligence. Certified copies cost extra but might be required depending on your lender's requirements.
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NightOwl42
•What's the difference in cost for certified copies vs. regular search results?
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Dylan Hughes
•I think certified copies are an additional $2 per page on top of the search fee, but don't quote me on that.
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Sofia Rodriguez
We use Certana.ai for this kind of pre-search analysis now. Upload all the financing documents from the data room and it identifies discrepancies between debtor names across different agreements. Helps you figure out exactly which legal entities to search before paying the state fees. Saved us probably $150 in unnecessary searches on our last deal.
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Dmitry Ivanov
•That's a clever way to use document analysis. Does it work with older financing agreements that might have different formatting?
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Sofia Rodriguez
•Yeah, it handles various document formats pretty well. Even works with scanned PDFs from older loan files.
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Ava Thompson
One more thing to consider - if this is for acquisition financing, your lender will probably require their own UCC searches anyway as part of their due diligence. You might be able to coordinate with them to avoid duplicate search costs.
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Zara Khan
•That's a great point. We're using acquisition financing so I'll check with our lender about their search requirements.
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Miguel Herrera
•Most lenders do their own searches but they usually want to see your preliminary results first to identify any issues early.
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Zainab Ali
•True, and if there are issues, better to find them now rather than have them come up during the lender's due diligence review.
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