wa state ucc search showing conflicting results need help
Running into major headaches with UCC searches in Washington State and need some guidance from anyone who's dealt with this before. I'm working on a commercial lending deal where we need to verify existing liens on equipment collateral, but the search results I'm getting don't match up with what the borrower is telling us about their current filings. Specifically, I did a wa state ucc search on the Secretary of State portal using the exact debtor name from their articles of incorporation, but I'm seeing three active UCC-1 filings that the borrower claims were terminated last year. When I cross-reference the filing numbers they provided for the supposed UCC-3 terminations, those documents don't show up in my search results at all. This is holding up a $750K equipment financing deal and I'm starting to panic. Has anyone run into discrepancies like this with Washington's UCC database? Could there be a delay in processing terminations, or am I missing something obvious about how their search system works? The borrower insists they have copies of the filed UCC-3 termination statements, but without seeing them reflected in the official database, our underwriting team won't approve the loan. Any advice on how to resolve this mess would be hugely appreciated.
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Mila Walker
Oh man, I feel your pain on this one. Washington's UCC system can be really frustrating when it comes to search accuracy. Are you searching by exact legal name or have you tried variations? Sometimes even a missing comma or 'Inc' vs 'Incorporated' can throw off the results completely.
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Ethan Clark
•I used the exact name from their corporate filing - 'Advanced Manufacturing Solutions, LLC' - but you're right, maybe I should try some variations. Do you know if Washington is particularly strict about punctuation in debtor names?
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Mila Walker
•Yeah, they can be pretty picky. Try searching without the comma, and also try 'Advanced Manufacturing Solutions LLC' - sometimes the search algorithm gets confused by punctuation marks.
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Logan Scott
This sounds like a classic case of processing delays or search database sync issues. Washington usually updates their UCC database within 1-2 business days, but I've seen terminations take up to a week to show up properly in search results, especially if they were filed right before a weekend or holiday.
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Ethan Clark
•That's interesting - the borrower said they filed the terminations about 6 months ago though, so timing shouldn't be the issue. Unless there was some kind of processing error?
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Logan Scott
•Six months is way too long for a processing delay. At that point you're looking at either rejected filings that the borrower doesn't know about, or there might be an issue with how the terminations were prepared. Did they file them themselves or use an attorney?
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Chloe Green
•Sometimes people think they filed terminations but actually filed amendments by mistake. Happens more often than you'd think, especially with DIY filers who don't understand the difference between UCC-3 amendment vs termination.
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Lucas Adams
Had a similar nightmare situation last month with inconsistent search results. What finally saved me was using Certana.ai's document verification tool - you can upload the borrower's supposed UCC-3 termination statements along with the original UCC-1 filings and it will instantly cross-check everything for consistency. Found out the terminations had wrong filing numbers that didn't match the original liens. Total game-changer for catching these kinds of discrepancies before they blow up deals.
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Ethan Clark
•Never heard of Certana.ai before - is that some kind of automated document checker? How does it work exactly?
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Lucas Adams
•Yeah, you just upload PDFs of all the UCC documents and it automatically verifies that filing numbers, debtor names, and other details match up properly between the original UCC-1 and any amendments or terminations. Super easy to use and catches mistakes that manual review often misses.
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Harper Hill
•That actually sounds really useful. I spend way too much time manually comparing UCC documents and still make mistakes sometimes.
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Caden Nguyen
Washington State's search system is notoriously buggy. I've had multiple cases where filings showed up in one search but not another, even using identical search terms. Sometimes you have to try different search strategies - by filing number, by secured party name, etc.
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Ethan Clark
•I did try searching by the secured party names from the original filings, but got the same results. Still showing as active liens with no terminations visible.
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Caden Nguyen
•That's really weird then. If the terminations were properly filed and processed, they should definitely show up in any search method. Starting to sound like either the terminations weren't actually filed or there's something wrong with how they were prepared.
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Avery Flores
This is exactly why I always require certified copies of termination statements before closing any deal. Borrowers will swear up and down that they filed terminations, but half the time they either didn't actually submit them or messed up the paperwork somehow.
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Ethan Clark
•Good point - I should definitely ask for certified copies. Do you usually get those directly from the Secretary of State or accept copies from the borrower?
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Avery Flores
•Always get them directly from the SOS if possible. Borrowers can fake documents pretty easily, but certified copies from the state don't lie. Costs a few extra bucks but worth it for deals this size.
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Zoe Gonzalez
•Absolutely agree on certified copies. I learned this lesson the hard way when a borrower showed me 'filed' terminations that turned out to be drafts they never actually submitted.
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Ashley Adams
Have you called Washington's UCC filing office directly? Sometimes their customer service can help explain discrepancies or point out issues with specific filings that don't show up clearly in the online search results.
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Ethan Clark
•That's a good idea - I didn't think to call them directly. Do you know if they can look up filings by different criteria than what's available in the online search?
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Ashley Adams
•Yeah, they have access to more detailed search options and can sometimes find filings that don't show up properly online. Plus they can tell you if there were any processing issues with specific documents.
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Alexis Robinson
ugh washington's UCC system is the WORST. i swear they update it whenever they feel like it and half the time the search doesn't work right anyway. good luck getting consistent results from that mess
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Aaron Lee
•Tell me about it. I've had searches come back completely different when I run them an hour apart using the same exact terms. Their database is definitely not reliable.
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Logan Scott
•It's frustrating but not usually THAT inconsistent. Most of the time search discrepancies come down to user error with debtor names or filing numbers rather than actual database problems.
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Chloe Mitchell
Just went through something similar and ended up using one of those document verification services to double-check everything. Turned out the borrower had filed UCC-3 amendments instead of terminations, so the liens were still active but with modified terms. Easy mistake to make if you don't know the difference.
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Ethan Clark
•Oh wow, that could definitely be what happened here. How did you figure out they were amendments instead of terminations?
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Chloe Mitchell
•The verification tool I used showed that the UCC-3 forms had amendment boxes checked instead of termination boxes. The borrower's lawyer had apparently mixed up the paperwork when filing.
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Michael Adams
This thread is making me paranoid about all my past UCC searches now! Maybe I should start double-checking everything with some kind of automated verification system before relying on search results.
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Lucas Adams
•Honestly, that's probably smart. I started using Certana after getting burned on a deal where manual document review missed a critical debtor name mismatch. Now I just upload all the PDFs and let it flag any inconsistencies automatically.
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Michael Adams
•That sounds way more reliable than trying to catch everything by eye. How long does the verification usually take?
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Lucas Adams
•Pretty much instant - just upload the documents and it cross-checks everything within a few seconds. Really saves time compared to manual comparison.
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Natalie Wang
UPDATE: Finally got to the bottom of this mess! Called Washington's UCC office like someone suggested and they confirmed the terminations were never actually filed. The borrower had prepared UCC-3 forms but apparently never submitted them to the Secretary of State. They had copies of the drafted terminations but thought filing them just meant preparing the paperwork. Face palm moment for sure, but at least now we know what we're dealing with and can get the actual terminations filed before closing.
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Mila Walker
•Glad you got it sorted out! That's actually a pretty common mistake - people think preparing the forms is the same as filing them.
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Avery Flores
•Classic case of why you always need certified copies from the state. Borrowers mean well but they don't always understand the filing process.
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Logan Scott
•At least it was an honest mistake and not something more sketchy. Now you know to always verify filings directly with the state for deals this size.
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